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NautiC25
Admiral

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USA
957 Posts

Response Posted - 12/05/2011 : 15:08:26

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Steve Milby
 Years ago, I invited my former mother-in-law (a very proper Philadelphia lady) to sail on my C25, and she asked me if she should bring her deck chair. That's when I realized that her impression of my boat didn't exactly conform to the reality.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
ROFL!

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New Wave
Deckhand

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USA
12 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2011 : 11:51:18

Hi All. Once again thanks for all the great help. I am sorry to be so "mysterious", I am not trying to be (I'm starting to feel like the "Lady in Red" - I wish!) But I do have my reasons for not posting all my info. And no, I did not steal the sailboat.... it's a divorce thing.

I tried to look at some pictures I had of the boat but the boat is too far away in the pictures to see the stays or the details of furler. I really do think that it is the type of furler that uses the forestay though. I will be heading out to marina sometime soon to see what type of system I have and to try to undo my mess, but right now I am at home sick with a bad cold and laryngitis that I probably picked up while I was out on the boat in the cold removing pins I shouldn't be removing!

The response on this forum is absolutely amazing! I can see that if I decided to keep the boat I would have quite a support network to help me along, so I will consider it definitely. I am already getting into learning all the terms and lingo - it is very interesting. I really wish I had found this place BEFORE I started doing anything to the boat :)

Thanks again and I will keep you all posted. Fingers crossed that mast is still standing!

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dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2011 : 13:32:09

If you can't get the forestay/furler drum reconnected to the bow fitting, look around for a small shackle to put between the bow fitting and the pin under the drum. This will be a short-term connection only and will be loose, but it will keep the forestay/furler drum connected to the bow while you remove the headsail for the winter.
You will then be able to more safely loosen the backstay and aft lower shrouds just a few turns to reconnect the forestay. As suggested earlier, count the number of turns so you can restore the settings to where they were. Also, assuming you have open turnbuckles, make sure you can still see at least one thread on the ends of both bolts in the turnbuckles. That way you will not run the risk of loosening the turnbuckles so much that they might open up on you. A small adjustable wrench and a screwdriver are good tools for this job. Use the wrench to hold the bolt above the turnbuckle and keep it from turning, and the screwdriver to turn the turnbuckle body. If you have closed turnbuckles, i.e. a solid tube-like turnbuckle body, wrap some electrical tape around the turnbuckle body and use small locking pliers (Vicegrips) instead of the screwdriver to turn the turnbuckle body. The tape keeps the plier jaws from scratching up the turnbuckle body.

Edited by - dmpilc on 12/06/2011 13:45:04

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9076 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2011 : 17:48:48

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by John Russell
 ...loosening the backstay could cause the mast to fall...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">IMHO, it would reduce the chances of it falling. If the forestay is detached, the backstay is pulling against the two forward lower shrouds, trying to pull the mast down, and the backstay has the mechanical advantage. Easing it via the turnbuckle (not detaching it) would reduce the imbalance of forces. Then easing the two "aft lower shrouds" (there are four cables leading from the deck up to mid-mast, two starting forward of the mast and two behind, or "aft" of it) should allow the forestay to be reattached to the "stem fitting" on the deck at the bow.

I do agree, however, with John's admonition to get help. You need to cut through what could be some shaky interpretations by us about exactly what's going on. Indeed you do not want the mast coming down unexpectedly or with just you around it. Most marinas that pull boats out of the water have employees who raise, lower, rig, and unrig masts, including those with furling systems.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 12/06/2011 17:54:01

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2011 : 18:52:17

I thought of that, Dave, but I figured if it didn't fall right away, it wasn't likely to fall unless it got fiddled with a bit. Loosening the backstay a little might be a good idea but loosening it too much would likely be very bad and New Wave probably doesn't know where that line is. Hell, I'm not sure I know where that line is. So, to do nothing was, IMHO, the best advice. Another thing in her favor was that the boom and main had been removed so the weight aft of the mast was lessened.

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JimGo
Admiral

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USA
962 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2011 : 19:04:23

It's a shame she isn't closer to anyone on here, espeically someone with an A-frame that they could lend her. Then she could just drop the mast for now, take down the head sail, and deal with everything in the spring.

New Wave, that's something you might want to consider. Building an A-frame isn't complicated, and it makes dropping the mast a piece of cake. With the mast down, you shouldn't have as much of a problem with worrying about the sail catching the wind, so I would think it will be easier to remove the head sail.

As for the divorce thing, that's fair enough (for now...we'll hound you, in a good way! :). You might consider enlisting the aid of Steve or one of the "flag line" to help identify someone who is local who could help you. Simply let them know where you're located. If you're anywhere near the Philadelphia, PA area, I'd be happy to find a time to meet you.

Edited by - JimGo on 12/06/2011 19:06:20

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9076 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2011 : 22:01:39

John, the geometry of the C-25 rig is different from the C-250. The C-25 has four lower shrouds in a rectangle, that can hold the mast up by themselves, although probably not against a lot of strain. Either the forestay or the backstay alone could strain them, especially being much higher on the mast. I'd say that if either is detached, the other (backstay in this case) should be loosened to the point of not pulling on the top of the mast, until its opposite (the forestay in this case) is attached.

We have registered owners in Indianapolis, Chicago, and Holland, MI--I don't know if anyone is closer to Michigan City. But this is very generic stuff--the rig and the furler are not unique to the C-25 or to Catalinas. I suggest concentrating on getting the first available person, even you have to pay for a yard guy or a rigger, to straighten this out. It should take somebody half an hour, including a 15-minute coffee break.

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panhead1948
Captain

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345 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2011 : 22:43:13

Steve I tried to E-mail her but got no reply. I live in northern ohio and I could probably get up to Michigan city and help out.Panhead48.

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5895 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 05:58:15

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by panhead1948
 Steve I tried to E-mail her but got no reply. I live in northern ohio and I could probably get up to Michigan city and help out.Panhead48.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Thanks for your generous offer Kevin. We all needed help as newbies. If she contacts you, I'd suggest you take a ladder and board the boat at the bow, because, if the mast comes down while boarding, it will fall aft. Then the first thing I'd do is attach a halliard to the bow, to use as a substitute forestay. That will stabilize the mast, and then you can take your time to get the sail off.

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Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 07:15:51

I suggest that you go back and edit the home town name out of your posts.

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Sam001
Vice Commodore

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USA
441 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 08:12:56

I will add my small voice to the "get local help"-it is still sailing and there should be a sailor who can help who is right there.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9076 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 08:34:46

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 09:50:14

That was my first reaction too, Dave. Then I realized Dave5041 was probably talking about New Wave's location that has popped up in a couple of posts and she's specifically tried to keep it anonymous.

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5895 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 10:53:50

I don't recall her home town appearing. Only the location where the previous owner kept the boat has appeared, and that was necessary to get help for her, if she chose to accept it. I don't know where she lives. Like most of us, it's probably some distance from the marina.

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 13:00:30

None the less, there is no reason to put it on display.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5895 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 14:10:02

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Dave5041
 None the less, there is no reason to put it on display.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
What I'm saying is that her home town was never put on display. There was a good reason to disclose the location of the marina - it was to try to find a volunteer close enough to be able to help her before a big wind came along and caused the boat to suffer severe damage. Having acquired the boat in the manner she did, she might not have thought about insurance yet, and, if it should be damaged, it could be disastrous for her.

I considered the privacy question, and under the circumstances, it seemed like the reasonable thing to do. After I posted the request for someone to assist her, she sent me a very nice email thanking me for my help. If she was upset for any reason about my effort to help her, she certainly never indicated it to me. In fact, the way that I learned the location of the marina was that she disclosed it to me in a previous email. I decided that, if she revealed it to me, a complete stranger to her, then she must not consider it a privacy concern.

Unless I hear otherwise from her, I'm certainly not going to be deterred from helping other newbies simply because someone doesn't agree.

You're entitled to your opinion, but you weren't aware of the offline communications that she and I had which I think put the matter in a different light.

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2011 : 21:00:05

I was aware that a suggestion that off line communication be arranged and thought it a pretty reasonable solution. I'll sign off since my opinion is clear and it isn't my privacy issue.

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5895 Posts

Response Posted - 12/08/2011 : 06:22:39

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Dave5041
 I was aware that a suggestion that off line communication be arranged and thought it a pretty reasonable solution. I'll sign off since my opinion is clear and it isn't my privacy issue.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">You're right about one thing. This isn't your privacy issue. We'll discuss it further offline, which is where you should have raised it in the first place.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 12/08/2011 : 16:10:04

Psst, hey, New Wave, ignore the last few posts. We really are the happy family you thought we were. We just occasionally act weird when our boats are in cradles and on trailers instead of in the water. The term is "being on the hard" meaning on dry land but really it is a time when we all get a little crazy. Please stick around this winter, we are fun to watch.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 12/08/2011 : 16:12:08

Oh, one other thing... i had no idea you were a woman after reading your first post, you just sounded like we all did when we got our boats; just another sailor.

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Tom Gauntt
Navigator

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204 Posts

Response Posted - 12/08/2011 : 16:39:09

New Wave,

In a strange way, the last few posts should show you how much this forum cares. One member sees your predicament and is essentially issuing a "Calling all cars, calling all cars" scene from the movies to get you some needed help and and yet another member is fiercely protecting your privacy since you've intimated some concerns.

Both are looking out for you in their own way.

Regarding your forestay issue, please seek help if you are not sure what to do next. If you have indeed pulled the clevis pin from the forestay/stem attachment point, your mast is being held up by the forward lower shrouds only. If you loosen the backstay and the turnbuckle comes apart, all that is holding the mast up is the aft and forward lower shrouds. It really wouldn't take much for the mast to drop. Please be careful. I think any sailor with some experience could get you squared away in about 15 minutes and would gladly help if asked. Don't be shy about asking for help and don't be shy about confessing your level of experience. Once you have this solved, it will be a wonderful learning experience. We've all been where you are now. Best of luck.

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panhead1948
Captain

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345 Posts

Response Posted - 12/08/2011 : 23:13:50

Dear Newwave I sent you an E-mail not sure you got It. I live on lake Erie. I am about 3 to 4 hrs from you I think. I am willing to drive up and help you out. I.ve had my 25 since 92 but have belonged to this site maybe 4 or 5 years. We love out boats and want anyone that has a chance to own one to enjoy the expereience like we do. Hope I can be of some assistance Panhead

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dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 12/11/2011 : 15:27:15

Update? Inquiring minds want to know!!

Edited by - on

panhead1948
Captain

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345 Posts

Response Posted - 12/11/2011 : 21:28:56

I've sent E-mails but have heard nothing.

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Happy D
Admiral

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921 Posts

Response Posted - 12/12/2011 : 17:06:16

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">DO NOT LOOSEN THE BACKSTAY OR THE SHROUDS!!!!!! At least not yet. A lot of the advice you're getting is based on assumptions that could be wrong. If you pulled the pin securing the headstay, the mast could fall. A falling mast can kill somebody<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Really? with the lowers still connected? I doubt it.

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