Catalina - Capri - 25s International Assocaition Logo(2006)  
Assn Members Area · Join
h.jpg Home.
a.jpg Association Forum
s.jpg Ships Store
c.jpg Cruising
r.jpg Racing
t.jpg Technical Tips
g.jpg Photo Gallery - New
o.jpg Boat Search - Updated
m.jpg Manuals & Brochures
3rdrpt.jpg Swap Meet
l.jpg Links
f.jpg Officer Flag Line & Staff
b.jpg Bylaws & Constitution
 
1.jpg Members Area
1.jpg Join the Association
 
Notice:
The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.
 
Association Forum
Association Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Forum Users | Search | FAQ
Username:
 Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums
 Catalina 250 Specific Forum
 Adjustable Backstay for C250s		  New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  

windsong
Captain

Member Avatar

USA
318 Posts
Initially Posted - 02/21/2010 :  19:25:41  Show Profile
I've been wanting a backstay adjuster for Windsong since I bought her last year. The odd port-side placement of the single backstay meant that all the existing "kits" at CD and elsewhere are unusable. After talking this over with Catalina Direct, they came up with a solution that works great. I installed it last weekend, and I'm pleased with the results. It includes two fiddle blocks, a block for the wire and all the various fittings. You will have to install a second U-bolt on the deck a few inches forward of the existing bolt to create the second stay attachment. The kit includes an entirely new backstay wire(bulkier than the one that came with the boat) and a Norseman swageless so you can cut the stay to proper length. I didn't trust myself to do this, so I hired a professional rigger to help. For all you owners of boats configured like mine, I thought it may interest you to know there is a solution to this problem. Here are some pics of how it looks on the boat. Fair winds!

P.S. Note that after using this upgrade, I don't recommend it. See later posts for more info.

Michael Hetzer
"Windsong"
2009 Catalina 250 WK HN984
Myrtle Beach, SC
Edited by - windsong on 04/18/2010 14:16:39

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3704 Posts
Response Posted - 02/21/2010 :  19:51:46  Show Profile
Michael, that looks great! Let us know how the performance is.

On another topic. Could you post a photo of your rudder where the upper pintle, lower pintle and Edson steering arm mount on the starboard side of the rudder? I am getting a new rudder from Catalina and it would help to see that portion of your rudder and the "indentations" where those components mount. Thanks!
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

windsong
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
318 Posts
Response Posted - 02/22/2010 :  08:28:44  Show Profile
I'll let you know about performance next weekend, when I take her out. I'll take some pics for you of the rudder at that time. A new rudder, eh?
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3444 Posts
Response Posted - 02/22/2010 :  08:52:54  Show Profile
I wonder if that might be the best way to convert from my split backstay to a single? Does anybody know why Catalina chose to put the attachment on the port side rather than starboard? Is there a structural difference. I think I'd prefer starboard.

How is the upper block attached? Is it swedged on or screwed on where the turnbuckle was?
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

windsong
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
318 Posts
Response Posted - 02/22/2010 :  09:49:03  Show Profile
I can't answer to the question about port versus starboard. My motor is starboard, so any backstay to starboard is unworkable. You will certainly want to have a look behind the bulkhead to make sure you can safely attach the new U-bolt. If, for example, you had a head instead of a porta-potty, as I have, there may not be a place to make the attachment.

The top block of the backstay adjuster is swaged to the new backstay.
Edited by - windsong on 02/22/2010 09:54:04
Go to Top of Page

windsong
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
318 Posts
Response Posted - 04/18/2010 :  14:11:14  Show Profile
I promised to give a report on performance. It works as well as you would expect, but there is a BIG problem. If you really crank down on the adjuster to introduce aggressive bend, the port inner shroud goes slack. This is clearly a consequence of having the single backstay connected on the port side. The mast is being pulled and/or twisted in that direction.

This has presented me with a puzzle for tuning purposes. If I tune the rig with no backstay, then if I apply backstay I will have thrown it out of balance. If I tune it with backstay on, then when I ease the backstay the port inner becomes rod-tight, and I worry about the integrity of the rig. I've opted to tune the rig with typical, sailing backstay tension and pretty much leave it there - which kinda defeats the purpose of the upgrade, doesn't it?

Frankly, at this point, I can't recommend this upgrade for C250 owners.

P.S. At least it looks cool. :)
Edited by - windsong on 04/18/2010 14:12:33
Go to Top of Page

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
10005 Posts
Response Posted - 04/18/2010 :  16:08:45  Show Profile
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by windsong</i>
<br />I promised to give a report on performance. It works as well as you would expect, but there is a BIG problem. If you really crank down on the adjuster to introduce aggressive bend, the port inner shroud goes slack. This is clearly a consequence of having the single backstay connected on the port side. The mast is being pulled and/or twisted in that direction.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">...which leads me to the question I didn't ask earlier: Why not run the other leg to the same spot on the starboard side, thereby centering the backstay. I'll guess the answer: To much obstruction for somebody standing at the wheel. (...therefore a better solution with a tiller.)

I'd be leery of attaching to the catbird seats, but what about the edges of the decks, hopefully position so the access to the seats is not compromised? That along with a high enough junction could open up the helm area somewhat... Just guessing. You might have to give up something to get the mast control you want.
Edited by - Dave Bristle on 04/18/2010 16:18:56
Go to Top of Page

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
2980 Posts
Response Posted - 04/19/2010 :  05:16:16  Show Profile  Visit Arlyn Stewart's Homepage
Michael.... I applaud your forthrightness in reporting to the forum the results. Wishing to have on the fly rig tuning like most sailboats enjoy is a natural desire but for the most part not in the cards for the C250.
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

2272 Posts
Response Posted - 04/21/2010 :  11:26:20  Show Profile
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Dave Bristle</i>
...which leads me to the question I didn't ask earlier: Why not run the other leg to the same spot on the starboard side, thereby centering the backstay...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
A split, symmetrical aft backstay is how earlier C250s are rigged. Obstruction to boarding and/or helm is very minor.

I wonder why Catalina went to a single on the C250. The asymmetry clearly makes tuning difficult. When shopping I saw an older C28 like this, and I didn't like it there either.
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

frogger
Navigator

Members Avatar

USA
184 Posts
Response Posted - 05/17/2010 :  06:25:07  Show Profile
I removed the split backstay and replaced it with a similar single backstay as on Windsong but I did attach it to the starboard catbird seat. So far no problems.
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
2980 Posts
Response Posted - 05/17/2010 :  15:24:04  Show Profile  Visit Arlyn Stewart's Homepage
Actually, the 250 started with a single, then it was split at arms reach, then it was returned to single again a good bit after the cat bird seats were introduced because of difficulty getting around it with the cat bird anchoring locations and wheel steering. The earlier split without the catbird seats allowed reasonable clearance with a wheel.
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3704 Posts
Response Posted - 05/17/2010 :  16:48:25  Show Profile
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">A split, symmetrical aft backstay is how earlier C250s are rigged. Obstruction to boarding and/or helm is very minor.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I found the split stay to be an obstacle in moving about the cockpit. We went to a single backstay anchored by the ladder transom cutout (where Catalina now puts the attachment) and are very happy with it. Quite a few have made this mod.
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page
  Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Association Forum © since 1999 Catalina Capri 25s International Association Go To Top Of Page
Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.06
Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.