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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Hull Leak !

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najewicz
Deckhand

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USA
14 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/28/2002 : 19:10:34

If anyone could give me any guidance on this issue I would greatly apprciate it. Recently I have what I thought was a small, persistent leak in what I thought was my cockpit drains. Every few days I would find 6-12 oz of water in my rear bilge. I assumed it was rain water leaking in the cockpit drains ( I had this problem in the past and "solved" it by using sealant on the tube to transom joints.

Tonight I found the water as usual, however it has not rained, I wiped up the water and noticed a very small trickle comming down the rear section of the hull, I wiped it up and in a few minutes it was there again. Now this is a very small trickle. I am leaning in the opening in the rear quarter berth and watching were the trickle is coming from. I finally realise it seem to starting at a rough patch of on the floor of the hull about 2 feet back from the quater berth cutout. If I wiped it up, in a few seconds ~10 to 20, there would be a small rivlet of water starting down towards the bilge!

Now my boat is 20 years old, however and for most of it's life it was only in the water 3 months a year: however since I moved to Kentucky thee years ago I have kept it in th water year round ( it never get very cold here, and I often sail in the winter).

My question is has anyone heard of leak like this - apparently right through the hull on a c-25? I though the hulls could get blisters, but I nver heard of an outright leak through the hull. My assumption is that the hull is solid fibergalss in this area - about 2 feet in front of the transom and mid-way between the centerline and the water line.

If anyone can give me any information on a similar situation I would appreciate it. I have a trailer and plan to pull the boat next week.

Thanks

Dave Najewicz
'82 SR/SK

Edited by - on

Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 06/29/2002 : 04:21:00

My first though is if you use to keep the boat out of the water on a trailer or on stands that the hull may have been craked or damaged by such a practice. If the boat were on stands not placed properly it could have caused this. You also mention a patch. Is it a repair form a previous owner ? And if so it may have been done incorectly. Do you have a trailer? If not do you have access to a boat yard. I would want to get a look at the hull exterior. Are you a swing keel or fin ? Has the boat ever been run aground ? Do you have a digital camera or can you borrow one. Pictures realy help. Sorry for all the questions back but with a little help you should be able to fix the problem. Lets see where did I put that duct tape<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2d808b3127cce9ec0e76d64b20000001410" border=0>

Doug&Ruth
Wind Lass
Tacoma Wa.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 06/29/2002 : 22:05:35

Hi Dave... Are you the original owner? If not, it sounds like you may have found a poorly executed repair to the hull by a DPO. It probably won't sink you any time soon, but any pounding (boat wakes, etc.) could make it somewhat worse. Damage in the aft area is unusual--it could have been from improper handling by somebody lifting the boat out. It also could have been caused by an improperly set up trailer, although even that is unusual. C-25 hulls are pretty strong. I'd get a fiberglass pro to look at it. Hull repairs are not for untrained do-it-yourselfers--as suggested by your situation.

Dave Bristle - 1985 C-25 #5032 SR-FK-Dinette "Passage" in SW CT

Edited by - on

najewicz
Deckhand

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USA
14 Posts

Response Posted - 06/30/2002 : 22:00:56

Dave Nd Dout,

Thanks for the replies, I was away for the weekend, and when I returned (Sunday Evening) I checked and I had about 2-3 oz in the bilge. This time I brought my flashlight and stuck my head down in the quarterbearth cut out. The leak was not coming from where I thought on Friday, but actually further aft. There was a lot of "dust" down there and I could see the darker "wet spot" starting from just about where teh quarter bearth floor meets the hull, nearly at the back of the hull. It just seems to be "weeping" from this area very slowly. On hot days I'll bet it evaporates before it reaches the bilge.

There was no sign of fiberglass repair or anything else that made this spot look different from the rest of hull bottom.

Regarding your quesestions, the boat was kept on a cradle ( which I still have) prior to my purchase about 4 years ago. I used to keep it on Lake George in Upstate NY ( a really beautiful lake) however three years ago I moved it to Louisville KY where I now work and sail on the Ohio. During my ownership of the boat, I had a "boat guy" who launched it off the cradle which he would mount to his flat bed trailer. The previous owner had the boat moved by a boat yeard, I don't know the details. Recently I bought a trailer ( built for a hunter 27 full keel) which will be plenty big for the c-25.

I don't believe the cradle supports went this far back on the hull, so it seems unlikely damage was done by the cradle. The previous owner seemed to take good care of the boat and did not mention anything about a serious hull issues. Since I have owned the boat I cannot recall any "Hard" groundings involveing the stern ( nor the bow) sure there have been seveal mudbanks, etc. but the C-25 is a pretty robust boat.

I play to pull it next week ( the wind dies here during mid summer and the boat yards here have lots of room since the power boaters are all out on the water). I will let it dry out for a week or so. There is a "sailboat" guy who does repairs, I will talk to him about it as well.

I needed new bottom paint anyway, It's been the water for three years. However I think I will sand it down to the gelcoat, fix any blisters ( I am sure there will be some) and do a good expoy barrier coat before I put on new bottom paint. Hopefull that will fix the problem.

Thanks for the advice.

Dave Najewicz - C-25 '82 Std Rig/Swing Keel

Edited by - on

tinob
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1883 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2002 : 09:07:33

Hi Dave,

Sounds like a lower gudgeon leak. Is the leak in the center of the transom interior? They have been reported here as potential leakers. With the boat out of the water check the taughtness of the screws there and if they require tightening it might be your leak source. Back them out enough to squeeze some polysulphide sealant behind the gudgeon and tighten again. It is suggested that when tightening this sealant that you do not tighten totally at first, then let cure over night and retighten the next day.

Val on "CALISTA" #3936
Tall/Wing '83
Patchogue,N.Y.

Val Bisagni

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2002 : 17:18:32

If she's leaking while at rest and when it's not raining, I'd rule out the lower gudgeon--it's above the waterline. (Although checking and rebedding it is a good idea, and easy to do.) Do you have a depth sounder or speed paddle wheel back in that area? Beyond that, I can't think of anything besides hull damage. Barrier coat may fix it temporarily, but any flexing will end that dilusion. Your "sailboat guy" should definitely look at it--once you find it, it'll probably be no big deal.

BTW, 2-3 oz. in the bilge?? I wish mine were that dry!

Dave Bristle - 1985 C-25 #5032 SR-FK-Dinette "Passage" in SW CT

Edited by - dave bristle on 07/01/2002 17:21:35

Edited by - on

Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2002 : 17:28:31

This leak is going to be fun to find. I dont know about the rest of the fleet but the transom of my boat is above the waterline. I have several inches above the water where the hull curves up to meet the sturn. So why would it leak at the bottom to transom transition??. Its not condensation is it ???

Doug&Ruth
Wind Lass
Tacoma Wa.

Edited by - on

tinob
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1883 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2002 : 09:35:47

My gudgeon doesn't leak but when underway making way the hull squats and the gudgeon is under water at that time. I would also suspect that a standing hull, rocking and rolling, might have a gudgeon submerged long enough to take on 2/3 ounces of water.
Val on "CALISTA" # 3936

Val Bisagni

Edited by - on

najewicz
Deckhand

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USA
14 Posts

Response Posted - 07/14/2002 : 22:53:28

As Douglas noted in a previous post:

This leak is going to be fun to find. I dont know about the rest of the fleet but the transom of my boat is above the waterline. I have several inches above the water where the hull curves up to meet the sturn. So why would it leak at the bottom to transom transition??. Its not condensation is it ???

Doug&Ruth
Wind Lass
Tacoma Wa.

After a bit of vacation, while my boat was "drying out" on the trailer, I returned and pressure washed the hull. Near where my leak was on the interior, I found small hole in the gel coat/bottom paint, with a few crackes eminating out for an inch or so. There was some " discoloration" around it as well. I attacked it with my dremmel tool and found that it had a lot of "black stuff" in it which I kept following into the acutal hull lay-up. It seemed to go on for about a half inch. I widened the hole to about 1 inch and found a delaminated layer in the hull. I dremmeled through that right into the bilge area under the quarterberth. The area around the hole is a little soft. I am going to have my yard fiberglass guy take care of it, I probably will end up with a " hole" about 4" in diameter that need to be re-fiberglassed. Clearly a job for a professional.

I found a similar problem, although smaller. in the "keel extension" just forward of the rudder. Several people down and the yard have looked at it and no one has seen anything like it. The boat must have taken a good "rap" on the gel coat and over the last several years water has just worked it's way in. It's pretty amazing the hole in the gel coat/bottom paint was very small, no more than 1/8 inch.

the rest of the hull looks great, except for the thousands of tiny blisters between the tan external gel coat and the dark brown underlying gel coat ( Catalina molds in the dark brown boot strip with dark gel coat and it extends under the tan gel coat on the bottom). I sanded about 1/4th of the botttom today, I plan to put on an epoxy barrier coat, and bottom paint when the holes are fixed.

Thanks for all of the helpful comments and ideas.

Dave Najewicz
'82 SR/SK

Edited by - on

Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 07/14/2002 : 23:52:51

Dave Do you already have the barrier coat material ??? If not you should go to www.epoxyproducts.com/barrier4u.html and read up. I bought mine from them and it went on great.

Doug&Ruth
Wind Lass
Tacoma Wa.

Edited by - on

najewicz
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
14 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2002 : 21:41:21

Doug,

Thanks for the tip, somehow I got their web site a few weeks ago, as a practicing techie ( I am a development engineer) I really like what they had to say, and their prices looked good. I was tempted to do the copper/epoxy thing, but where I keep my boat (in a marina off the ohio river) the bottom is pretty prone to the dreaded sline/moss, so I want a bottom paint with some biocide as well as copper. As you can imagine the barnacles and zebra mussels are not too bad in Kentucky; it's the moss and slime that gets you. My swing keel looked like a "chia pet" after 3 years in the water.

Dave

Edited by - on

Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2002 : 22:01:43

I was thinking more along the line of the expoy barrier coat. Mine came out better than I ever though it would. Prep work is the key. <img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2dd04b3127cce9d4cdfa8ce610000005410" border=0>

Doug&Ruth
Wind Lass
Tacoma Wa.

Edited by - on

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