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Reefing the main

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Andy_334
Navigator

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USA
206 Posts

Initially Posted - 09/16/2006 : 11:47:56

Anyone reef their main?

What works? What doesn't? Do you use a reef horn on the gooseneck? How do you hold the reef-clew to the boom? details.... successes.....horror stories.........

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 09/16/2006 : 17:08:20

Pardon me dipping here, I am a big believer that if your reefed sail is not flat then the reef is only marginally effective. To that end I use two line reefing. One line is the reef tack and it gets hauled first after the halyard has been slackened. That happens with no tension since the halyard has been slackened. Once it is down I haul the clew with the other line, I am very successful in getting a good outhaul on the clew with a simple eye strap on one side of the boom and cheek slightly aft on the other side, the trick is to get the forward cheek aligned well with the halyard plate so it has constant tension regardless of the side the boom is on. My 2 cents.

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Andy_334
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Response Posted - 09/16/2006 : 20:53:08

Hi Frank. Thanks for your response. I'm not sure I completely understand your last comment about aligining the cheek with the halyard plate. Any chance you could expand on this? Or even post pictures? (pictures paint a 1000 words etc.)

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Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 09/16/2006 : 22:57:33

In this photo you can see that my forward cheek is too far aft of the gooseneck and I should have to the halyardplate block with the boomvang so it is centered on the mast. Where I have it led it hardens on a Starboard tack and softens on a port tack. I need to at least center my turning block on the halyard plate even if I do nothing about the forward cheek.

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existentialsailor
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1180 Posts

Response Posted - 09/18/2006 : 08:17:44

I don't have reefing on my mainsail, I either spill by letting the sail twist off at the top, play the traveler or I take it down and sail foresail only, (I have a furler).
When I find myself in so much wind that I only want the foresail up, I drop my outboard in to act as drag.

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shadleym
Deckhand

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USA
8 Posts

Response Posted - 10/02/2006 : 09:32:13

My wife and I reefed the main for the first time on our boat when we were out this weekend. It worked very nicely. Our main has a small D ring on each side just aft of the luff to hook on to the reef horns. We could only hook on one side because the extra reefed part of the sail was in the way on the other. We might have been able to get both the D rings hooked on if we'd really worked at it, but I'm not sure if you are supposed to.

Then we used one of the reefing lines that go through boom and out the aft end - the standard lines on the Capri25, I believe. We took this line up though the clew reefing grommet and back down to a horn cleat on the starbroard side of the boom near the aft end.

Besides the clew grommet, we have just one additional reefing grommet. We just used a small diameter line through this grommet to tie the sail to the boom.

So the procedure was to lower the main halyard until the reefing D ring on the front of the main could be hooked on to the reef horn on the gooseneck, and then tighten the halyard back up. [Arrgg. Forgot a step (see question at the bottom). We had to pull the mainsail track slide down so that we could pull the bottom of the sail out of the track when we lowered the halyard. We then ended up using that slide to hold the boom down when tightening the halyard.] Then, with the aft reefing line run through the clew reef grommet and back down to the horn cleat, just haul in on the reefing line all the way. This pulls the clew grommet down and back. We seemed to have enough mechanical advantage to get the foot pretty darn flat and the grommet pretty close to the boom. Then bunch up the extra sail and tie it to the boom using the reefing grommet in the middle of the sail.

We did not get the clew grommet snugged up against the boom as close as it might possibly be, but it was just a couple inches off the boom, and really seemed to be fine. We might have been able to pull it down further with another line, but I didn't think it was necessary.

We reefed because we knew the wind was forecast to build during the day, and because we wanted to make sure we could actually get the main effectively reefed before we really needed to. It was a good exercise, and it paid off, because the wind did indeed build to the point where we were really glad we had reefed. A couple other minor points. We just had a stopper not tied in the aft reefing line and it was pulled up the aft end of the boom for storage. From now on, if we think reefing will be a possibility on any given day, we'll go ahead and run the line through the clew grommet and cleat the end off on the horn cleat before we raise the sail. It wasn't too much of a chore to do that on the water, but reefing would have been a snap if that had already been done. Also, we talked through the process before we started it, but there is no substitute for experience. It's a really good idea to practice this once or twice when it isn't necessary so at least one person on the boat has done it before.

I do have one question maybe someone can help with [alluded to earlier]. But what are you supposed to do to hold the boom down? We ended up using the mainsail track slide to keep the boom from rising up when we were reefed. But I wonder if that's what you're supposed to do. We don't have a cunningham grommet we can use when reefed. Maybe we could have hooked the cunningham hook on the gooseneck somehow and used it as a downhaul, but I didn't see any obvious place to attach it. The mailsail track slide actually worked just fine, but it doesn't seem like quite the right solution. And we also tightened the boom vang. But it seems like there should be some kind of downhaul on the foreward end of the boom.

Edited by - on

existentialsailor
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1180 Posts

Response Posted - 10/02/2006 : 10:54:53

I have a hook on the port side of my gooseneck and a cleat on the same side of the mast. This setup can be used to hold the boom down, I use it as an effective downhaul, though greater purchase would be nice, I haven't rig it with any blocks.

Edited by - on

Ericson33
Admiral

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USA
892 Posts

Response Posted - 10/02/2006 : 13:11:36

Is your goosneck not bolted to the mast? I am getting the picture that it's attached with a mast slug.

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existentialsailor
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1180 Posts

Response Posted - 10/02/2006 : 13:27:26

This is what Capri's usually come with:

http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=292

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Ericson33
Admiral

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USA
892 Posts

Response Posted - 10/02/2006 : 15:03:56

Mine is attached to the boom with 4 stainless screws.

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Ericson33
Admiral

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USA
892 Posts

Response Posted - 10/02/2006 : 15:10:58

Yep, You are correct sir, No wonder I have such a hard time getting the Luff Rope in the mast groove, I bet I am 2" longer, do you have any photos of your setup?

My setup is wrong Photo

Edited by - Ericson33 on 10/04/2006 13:20:29

shadleym
Deckhand

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USA
8 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2006 : 09:06:24

Yeah, that drawing is what I have. I guess that's what Rick has, too. So Rick, do you have another cunningham hole above the reef point that you use as a cunningham when reefed, or do you not use the cunningham at all when reefed? It seems like I could just use the cunningham as a downhaul for the boom if I add some way to hook it on. Tightening the downhaul would then tighten the luff. Plenty of mechanical advantage. And tightening the luff of the sail is kind of what the cunningham is for. Say, I could just attach a short line to the gooseneck slide with a small bowline hanging down, and put the cunningham hook through that loop and snug it up. Well, that would do the job until I spend a bunch of hard-earned money on a fancy piece of hardware for it.

Also, in my description of the sequence of events for reefing, I think we were supposed to haul in the aft reefing line before adjusting the luff of the sail, not that it's a really big deal. But reefing the leech first would raise the boom up at the back of the cockpit and help keep it from flogging the skipper so much while the crew is messing around with the halyard.

Mike

Edited by - on

existentialsailor
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1180 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2006 : 10:42:57

Mike,

I don't have reef points. I use the hook and cleat for the boom and a seperate line for the cunningham to a hook on the base of the mast. Chris, (CAPRI 25) posted the drawing for the original setup and line runs on this forum under another topic, since there aren't that many postings here, should be easy to find. That way you can decide for yourself how you want to set it up. Obviously, you will not be able to get the exact same hardware as the Capri came with as most of the companies that supplied blocks and deck organizers and the like are long gone. No doubt, Harken and the others have suitable replacements. Personally, I'm a fan of Garhauer.

Hey Chris, how about resizing that drawing so we get rid of the horizontal scroll in this thread?

Edited by - on

Ericson33
Admiral

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USA
892 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2006 : 13:16:59

Edited by - on

saribella
Captain

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USA
286 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2006 : 14:28:09

Or one could go to Chris's Volare` webiste and print out the PDF file of the drawing.

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Ericson33
Admiral

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USA
892 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2006 : 16:05:45

Its on the Yahoo site also, I think that this file Rick got when he was talking with Kent Nelson at Catalina Yachts. I was more interested in the Fiberglass layup of the hull and deck.

I would love to spend a day in the Capri 25 folder at Catalina. I wonder if the molds are still laying around Catalina somewhere?

I need to take that stupid MIDI song off of the site, It now really bugs me

And for the last question of the day, Rick did Harry put reefing points on your main sail? The one I have was made for PHRF and Harry told me that the roach of the sail is a little larger than the OD of WYC. For whatever that means. So I need to send the main sail back to Harry during the winter and have him add some reef points.

I was coming in when Mike Shadley and his wife were sailing out on Sunday. The wind was just starting to pick up when we came in. I had taken the GPS and the fastest speed we got coming back downwind with Main sail only was 6.2 Knots. We were keeping pretty steady going upwind at 30% off of the wind staying in the 4 knot mark. We had some people with us that had never been sailing before, and I was trying to keep the boat as flat as possible. 15 deg.

Edited by - Ericson33 on 10/04/2006 16:13:38

existentialsailor
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1180 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2006 : 17:49:44

Chris,

No I haven't sent the sail to Harry for the reefing yet. Probably do so after I haul in Novemeber.

Going to get a 135 this time. That will give me a full set of sails as far as I am concerned. Would love to have one of Harry's 155 for the Capri, but not this year and mine is only 2 seasons old and it didn't get a lot of use this summer. Maybe I'll sell that and get a 155 from Harry. I'm that impressed with the mainsail.

Probably will sell the older main even though I just had Aqua Battens put in this season. They are great, but the EP main is much better.

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Ericson33
Admiral

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USA
892 Posts

Response Posted - 10/05/2006 : 10:55:34

I am too very impressed with the main sail from Harry, It really has my crew (that have been racing for 15 years) talking about how the shape of the sail makes a perfect foil shape. As for a 155% Genoa, I have all used sails, nothing is older than 2 years, but they are still used. I would love to have a new 155%, but the cost of the sail is usless to me right now when I am still learning the boat, and how she handles in different conditions. The 155% that I picked up was off of a S2 7.9 so the luff is about an inch shorter than specked, again I don't think I am that good of a sailor to notice the difference right now.

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existentialsailor
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1180 Posts

Response Posted - 10/05/2006 : 13:05:50

Chris,

I have a furler and I have no intention of getting rid of it, so I guess I take a few performance hits for that. I'm still at the point where the boat can usually take a lot more than I can, so I don't worry about it.

My current 155 is 5.6 oz cloth, Harry makes his pinstripe 155's out of 3.1 oz-that's almost half the weight! I have to believe it would make up for a lot of the disadvantage caused by the furler.

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dontluff
Deckhand

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Canada
22 Posts

Response Posted - 11/13/2006 : 17:20:46

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by existentialsailor
 This is what Capri's usually come with:

http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=292
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

And it's supposed to have two locking slugs, one above the goose neck and one below to keep the gooseneck in one place. Mine came that way from Catalina. I couldn't understand the other poster's comment about a boom that floats up !!!??? I dont' see how you could ever sail any boat properly without locking the the gooseneck in position.

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dontluff
Deckhand

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Canada
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Response Posted - 11/13/2006 : 17:52:15

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Andy_334
 Anyone reef their main?

What works? What doesn't? Do you use a reef horn on the gooseneck? How do you hold the reef-clew to the boom? details.... successes.....horror stories.........
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
If you're racing, use the tack horns: quickly lower the main halyard (helps to have a mark on the halyard near the clutch), have mast crew hook first reef tack cringle over the horn, adjust halyard tension, pull hard on the 1st reef outhaul.
If it's a round the cans event, leave the slab in the reef loose and flapping around. If a long race, use some sail ties through the reef cringles to tidy up the slab to stop it flogging in the wind.

Short handed reefing: Have another 1st reef tack line to pull the tack down (like a cunningham) so that you don't have to leave the cockpit to do it. All else remains the same.

In the days of MORC and droopy booms, I had a three reef setup: Flattening reef, 1st and a deeper 2nd reef for winds over 25 knots.

Note: each successive reef clew should raise the boom higher than the preceding reef. This is to try and stop the end of the boom dragging in bigger waves on reaches or when dumping the main in gusts and big angles of heel.

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