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Voyager
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Initially Posted - 03/01/2022 :  18:53:57  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
According to another sailing forum, Defender Industries, everybodyís family owned chandlery has been sold to Canadaís FortNine investors. See the article: https://www.mondaq.com/pressrelease/85502/FortNine-In-Partnership-With-Novacap-Acquires-Defender-Industries

While itís unknown what will become of Defender in years to come, it doesnít take a rocket scientist to realize that things will change. Prices have already been increased and it should not be too long that we see policy changes.

Alas, another basic staple of boating gear will be different for the coming year. Weíll see how things pan out.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT

bigelowp
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Response Posted - 03/03/2022 :  14:01:12  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, they have been sold and change will come. However when a family sells it usually is because either !. Estate forces it sold (read taxes) or 2. No one in the family wanted or was qualified to run it, or 3. they felt it would require too much capital to remain competitive. I find it interesting that the buyer has a strong e-commerce presence. Could be the "family" could not afford continual upgrades to tech, etc. As far as price increases, they are everywhere. This will be an expensive year on the water! times they ARE a changing!

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT
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bigelowp
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Response Posted - 03/03/2022 :  14:13:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
and . . . . reading about the sale in The New London Day newspaper, it appears that the family has been marketing the company for a while as they do not have the capital to continue its growth. The buyer wants to grow the customer base from the current 100,000 to into the millions. Ought to be an interesting ride!

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT

Edited by - bigelowp on 03/04/2022 11:59:17
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Voyager
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Response Posted - 03/03/2022 :  17:20:59  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Crazy idea but if the company can reach 10X more customers, they may enjoy better discounts. It follows that they can afford to pass the savings onto the customers. [LOL - what was I thinking!?!?]
Nonetheless, at least theyíll be around to give West Marine a run for their money.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT

Edited by - Voyager on 03/03/2022 17:22:20
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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
8892 Posts

Response Posted - 03/03/2022 :  20:06:47  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Voyager

...Prices have already been increased and it should not be too long that we see policy changes.
A few supplies I've looked at are still around 30% less at Defender than at West. (I don't worry about shipping--they're only 15 minutes away by Subaru--10 by my friend's Porsche...)

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, ex-OUPV,
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge (but still sailing when I can).

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 03/05/2022 10:11:38
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islander
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Response Posted - 03/05/2022 :  11:29:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dave, With gas going up 5-10 cents a day and heading north the shipping will soon be less than the cost to drive there.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound


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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
8892 Posts

Response Posted - 03/07/2022 :  22:20:07  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Scott: Watch that "Shipping" line on your order form... Somebody's got to buy the gas.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, ex-OUPV,
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge (but still sailing when I can).
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bigelowp
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Response Posted - 03/10/2022 :  09:01:54  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Defender "Warehouse Sale" is being replaced by a "Spring Prep Event" from March 24-26 for on-site only and then a "Spring launch Sale" between March 27- April 3 which is on-line and on-site. From preliminary perusal they appear to offer fewer and lower discounts than past Warehouse Sales and very restrictive number allowed into the store at a time (read: long lines). Hate to see the end of a 25+ year ritual of spring for boaters!

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT

Edited by - bigelowp on 03/10/2022 09:14:40
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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
8892 Posts

Response Posted - 03/10/2022 :  22:30:20  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The 3/24 - 3/26 sale is paint, zincs, and batteries only, in the warehouse store only, with only up to 40 people allowed in at a time. (Have fun standing in the line.) From 3/27 - 4/3 it's an online sale for what appears to be most of their products--the 40 person limit in the store will continue. (To me, that seems like 30' social distancing, but it's their store. I read it as "stay home"--and I will.)

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, ex-OUPV,
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge (but still sailing when I can).
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Voyager
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5045 Posts

Response Posted - 03/11/2022 :  19:49:03  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dave, I wonder whether they offer ďcurb service ď? You can order online then drive up to the store where someone comes out to your car with your order. I wonder whether theyíd do that rather than 40 max in the store?

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT
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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Response Posted - 03/11/2022 :  22:56:39  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bruce--they'd probably have a line of cars on Great Neck Road, sitting there burning their gas..... I think I'd rather pay for the delivery. And you live what, 4-5 gallons of gas away (at $4.50-$5.00 each)?

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, ex-OUPV,
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge (but still sailing when I can).

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 03/11/2022 23:09:07
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bigelowp
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Response Posted - 03/12/2022 :  06:53:14  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
FWIW -- I see this as their pivot from being retail and e-commerce to exclusively e-commerce (which is what the new buyers business model is) and I bet they close the retail store within the next 5 years.

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT
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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
8892 Posts

Response Posted - 03/12/2022 :  17:00:56  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I hope not--I and my friends use their proximity to get price matching at our local West Marine store. A half-hour drive over and back can be more than worth the difference... Here's an example of how brick-and-mortar is nice for seeing the actual products and getting advice, but online can be great for the variety of products--everything is there!

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, ex-OUPV,
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge (but still sailing when I can).
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Voyager
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Response Posted - 04/21/2022 :  07:16:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So I just took the plunge.
I tested out my 2002 Honda 8 outboard and while I eventually got it running okay after much messing around with the carb, the starter, the plugs and the coil, Iíve begun to lose faith that the engine will last the season or start reliably whenever I need it.

It has been awesome for years with only regular maintenance (oil, plugs, bottom unit grease, carb cleaner, o-rings) but I think that between the E-10 fuel, the salt water and the age, itís time to retire. [Now my 1978 British Seagull 2-stroke is still kicking fine, but itís a much less temperamental engine, much simpler].

Yesterday, I reviewed Defenderís outboard engine catalog and although the Tohatsus and Mercurys looked appealing, I found another Honda 8 XL Shaft with electric start, and alternator and a carb in my price range. I believe that it has the same bottom unit gear ratio and it comes with a 4 vaned propeller like the old one.

Only fly in the ointment is that itís backordered. Hmmm, the sales person is checking with their Honda rep. He said theyíre coming in in dribs and drabs, but thereís nobody on their waiting list ahead of me for this model, so when it comes in, itís mine. The other brands seem to have more of a backlog.

Iím very glad that I went with Defender. Theyíre not right in my neighborhood, but theyíre still brick and mortar for a while more, and theyíre just 50 miles down the road. I opted for customer pick up, so one fine day Iíll be getting out of the house for a day trip. Thatíll be a good antidote for my 2-year case of cabin fever!

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT
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bigelowp
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Response Posted - 04/21/2022 :  07:27:44  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bruce -- I would take your current Honda to a Honda dealer and have them service and advise. Maybe you need only a new carb, which should be way less expensive than an entire engine. FWIW I replace my carb on my 2007 Tohatsu every 5 years - as despite taking care it gets built-up "gunk" -- and I have less than 100 hours on it.

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT
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Voyager
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Response Posted - 04/21/2022 :  15:31:00  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Peter, thanks for your advice on this, however the deal is done with Defender. Hereís the listing:
https://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1%7C215570%7C1794283%7C1794305&id=7451893#

I will have to rehab my current engine until the new one comes in. I have a local Honda dealers, Two Hulls Marine at Captains Cove in Bridgeport where I can order the part.

I figure that once I update it, I can sell the current motor for a few bucks, so letís see what the market will bear in a time of high demand.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT
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bigelowp
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Response Posted - 04/21/2022 :  15:57:52  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I use Two Hulls Marine (also a Tohatsu dealer) they do great service and are reasonable.

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT
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Voyager
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Response Posted - 04/28/2022 :  07:48:26  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So now Iím looking at eBay and Craigslist to see what the resale value might be. Itís interesting. The net result is thereís a shortage of used outboard inventory available. Still, I have no idea when my new engine will show up. Meantime, Iíll take your advice on updating parts of my current outboard. The impeller looks good. I should replace my spark plugs and fuel filter.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT

Edited by - Voyager on 04/28/2022 07:50:15
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Voyager
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Response Posted - 06/01/2022 :  21:54:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Wow, patience is a virtue! In six weeks the new engine has arrived! Iím going to pick up my new beauty in Waterford, CT next week. Yes, gas is expensive however shipping is too, and in the past two years Iíve had too many large heavy items shipped by local shippers only to find them damaged in someway: a kitchen hutch was destroyed, my Old Town canoe was scratched very badly, a European TV stand was dinged in the last 60 miles from the international Airport by the local guys. So Iím driving my Ford the 110 miles round trip. @27 mpg thatís 4 gallons at $4.50 or $20 plus lunch. I havenít driven that far in awhile, I hope I can still handle it!

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT

Edited by - Voyager on 06/03/2022 21:54:49
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islander
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Response Posted - 06/04/2022 :  11:44:44  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bruce, Is your boat in the water? I'm wondering about hanging the new motor.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound


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Voyager
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Response Posted - 06/04/2022 :  20:52:37  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, Passage is on the dock and the engine is mounted on the bracket. Iím going to hire some of the boatyard crew to help me swap engines. I can back into a single boat slip and get help hoisting the engine around.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT
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Voyager
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Response Posted - 06/05/2022 :  10:17:20  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I succeeded in picking up the new outboard at Defender yesterday. It was a beautiful clear and bright day, perfect for a ride in the countryside. I could have driven straight up I-95 with all the crazies, but instead we took the seaside highways and byways along the Connecticut coastline.
The engine is shipped in a large, sturdy cardboard carton - about 62Ēx18Ēx14Ē. Itís all foam padded inside. It included the Honda XLS engine, a 14 liter fuel tank and a fuel line with primer bulb and end connectors. It even comes with a bottle of motor oil and filling nozzle.
We made a day of it, stopping for an authentic Connecticut lobster roll sandwich (no mayo) and fries. On the way back we treated ourselves to an ice cream cone. The CT beaches are wonderful and crowds were nonexistent for a sunny June afternoon. I suppose that because it was a little cool (~70į) and a low dew point (50į), the beach crowds found something else to do.
Now itís time to plan to replace my current engine ó at 100 poundsI wonít just be able to pop it off solo. I also want to prep and clean up the engine mount, prep the fuel-water separator for the new fuel line, replace the membrane, and check for bad gaskets and air leaks.
And now Iíll advertise the old unit for sale. It still starts and runs fine. We have a whole flock of weekend sailors in the harbor and at the three or four nearby marinas. Iíll probably advertise it old school with a poster at the marinas and boat launches. Maybe a post in the local boating mag.
It should sell quickly at $1500 since thereís a long waiting list for new models.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT
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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
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Response Posted - 06/05/2022 :  11:41:36  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I wonder if there are any differences from the one you're replacing (that I bought 20 years ago)...

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, ex-OUPV,
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge (but still sailing when I can).

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 06/05/2022 12:08:18
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Voyager
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Response Posted - 06/16/2022 :  18:32:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Itís largely identical, however, from what Iíve seen so far, itís better. Hereís the current status.

Yesterday, I worked with Steven, a boatyard technician, to remove the original engine and replace it with the new one. We were extremely careful and cautious to prevent any inadvertent damage moving a very heavy motor. I made sure to cushion it in every move to prevent scratches, dings or other damage. He hung it on the engine mount and we secured it with thumb screws and galvanized screws for extra measure.

I connected it to the battery and fuel line today. Started immediately and charged the system. Iíll be ďroad testingĒ it tomorrow around Milford.

I must observe the break-in period as advised in the ownerís manual, so I have to run the engine high, low, medium for a few hours. When tooling around the harbor, I generally vary my speed depending on traffic and other obstacles so that should not be a major inconvenience.

I do have a question about a fully sealed fuel system. The Honda-supplied fuel line hose appears quite a bit thinner than my current 3/16Ē ID hose. It wonít fit on the hose barb fittings on my Racor fuel/water separator. Is there any reducing adapter available to fit this hose? Or should I replace the fuel line and not use the manufacture-supplied hose?

The fuel/water separator really works very well.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain ó Milford, CT
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bigelowp
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Response Posted - 06/16/2022 :  20:00:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Better may be -- fuel injection vs. carburetor, or confidence vs not so. My luck with Honda outboards and lawn motors is terrible. Both needed pristine gas to work. My experience with Honda autos was much better. The most important break in period is changing the oil early as any metal particles need to be removed. I doubt RPM or "speed" is as important. Enjoy the confidence and hopefully reliability and fuel consumption of "new"

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT
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islander
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Response Posted - 06/18/2022 :  07:32:23  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
It wonít fit on the hose barb fittings on my Racor fuel/water separator. Is there any reducing adapter available to fit this hose?

Sure, Go to any auto store and get the right size barb.




Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound


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