Catalina - Capri - 25s International Assocaition Logo(2006)  
Assn Members Area · Join
h.jpg Home.
a.jpg Association Forum
s.jpg Ships Store
c.jpg Cruising
r.jpg Racing
t.jpg Technical Tips
g.jpg Photo Gallery - New
o.jpg Boat Search - Updated
m.jpg Manuals & Brochures
3rdrpt.jpg Swap Meet
l.jpg Links
f.jpg Officer Flag Line & Staff
b.jpg Bylaws & Constitution
 
1.jpg Members Area
1.jpg Join the Association
 
Notice:
The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.
 
Association Forum
Association Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Forum Users | Search | FAQ
Username:
 Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums
 General Sailing Forum
 Mr. Butler is ...		  New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

Member Avatar

Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts
Initially Posted - 04/09/2005 :  19:21:18  Show Profile  Visit Frank Hopper's Homepage
As most of you know the Catalina Mark II is not allowed to race OD with the original 22s. I believe Frank was not pleased to introduce the new 22 and have the National Association deny it class status. Serious 22 racers look for old light boats, sometimes several just to build up one competitive racer. Mr. Butler has introduced the National Association certified "other"22 (the Mark II is still available). Look at this thing! All those people with old boats are going to buy these by the droves. The man is a genius. Do you think it is really fair for a boat with substantially less windage to have been certified? The keel is encapsulated, so it is fair. The wide side decks will be MUCH better for crew work (Fair?)




Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts
Response Posted - 04/09/2005 :  19:25:57  Show Profile  Visit Frank Hopper's Homepage
By the way, the old one is a double digit Sail number National Champion that was just replaced!
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5896 Posts
Response Posted - 04/09/2005 :  20:20:39  Show Profile
I think the objective of folding the old and new boats together into the C22 National Association is a good thing. I suspect Frank B. found that the somewhat dated look of the old C22 made it difficult to sell new ones. A fresh design that performs reasonably comparably with the old C22 could revitalize the class.

The test is how closely comparable they are when raced head-to-head. You're probably right that the new one is faster than the old one, but perhaps not so much as to be fundamentally unfair, at least for most club racers. That remains to be seen. If there is a big difference in performance, they could split the fleet into two classes, racing the old designs in one class and the new designs in the other, as we do with tall and standard rig boats. It seems that there ought to be a way to do it fairly, so that they would all be "C22s," and members of the C22 National Association. In time, as the old version C22s disappear from the scene, the only remaining members of the C22 National Association will be the new version C22s.
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3321 Posts
Response Posted - 04/09/2005 :  21:40:03  Show Profile
The C22 Nationals will be on Canyon Lake this year. It will be interesting to see if they get any of the new boats racing. Has their Natl. Assoc. agreed to allow their entry?
Derek
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts
Response Posted - 04/09/2005 :  23:28:31  Show Profile  Visit Frank Hopper's Homepage
My understanding is they drove the whole project. They conferred on the design and made trips out to California during the design. If they turn on it now I would hate to think what Frank would do.
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

aeckhart
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1709 Posts
Response Posted - 04/10/2005 :  09:48:19  Show Profile  Visit aeckhart's Homepage
If the C22 National Association can influence Catalina's design people why couldn't we, as an associaton, influence them regarding our discussed C25/250 redesign or possibly a trailerable 26 foot racer/cruiser. Or is it even worth the effort. Perhaps we are a bastard child with no influence, since we sail a boat that is no longer in production.

Al
GALLIVANT #5801
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts
Response Posted - 04/10/2005 :  10:14:39  Show Profile
Speaking of the C22 National Regatta, they will be racing in three classes;

<b>Genoa Gold Class</b> - Boats that <i>have </i>a 1st place in a state/regional/national regatta
<b>
Genoa Silver Class</b> - Boats that <i>don't</i> have a 1st place in a state, regional, or national regatta.

<b>Spinnaker Class</b>

Out of these three classes, only the winner of the Genoa Gold Class is crowned National Champion.

Not being a racer myself, I was wondering if allowing only the elite sailor's to compete for the National Championship was a standard practice?
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5896 Posts
Response Posted - 04/10/2005 :  11:07:58  Show Profile
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I was wondering if allowing only the elite sailor's to compete for the National Championship was a standard practice?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">There are so many C22's, and they are so easy to trailer that they would probably have several hundred boats hitting the starting line in some years, if they didn't figure out some way to limit their numbers in the big regatta. Can you imagine the length of that starting line, and all the shouting as they all head for the sweet spot at the favored end of the line!
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts
Response Posted - 04/10/2005 :  17:31:24  Show Profile
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Steve Milby</i>
<br />There are so many C22's, and they are so easy to trailer that they would probably have several hundred boats hitting the starting line in some years, if they didn't figure out some way to limit their numbers in the big regatta. Can you imagine the length of that starting line, and all the shouting as they all head for the sweet spot at the favored end of the line!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

That makes sense...Having that many boats at the start must be some sight!

Thanks for the info.
Edited by - on
Go to Top of Page
  Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Association Forum © since 1999 Catalina Capri 25s International Association Go To Top Of Page
Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.06
Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.