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Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Initially Posted - 09/06/2003 : 19:07:59

Maybe a little off the subject, but not totally. The computer you are staring at at this very moment <img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>, and the forum you are visiting with it, are, after all, a part of our total sailing experience.

Quote from www.apple.com

"32-bit PCs can only use 4GB of memory. Any more than that requires the use of virtual memory on the hard drive, which is 40 times slower than using RAM. The new Power Mac G5 can offer up to 8GB of RAM thanks to the 64-bit G5. So you can store entire 3D worlds, huge scientific data sets and oversized 2D images all in main memory, which lets you manipulate them faster. To repeat: 40 times faster. Theoretically, the 64-bit data paths let the Power PC G5 access up to 4 terabytes of physical memory."

That's 8 GIG of RAM folks......and the new word of the day is: Terabyte.........<img src=icon_smile_cool.gif border=0 align=middle> If only I had the 20Bu's to throw at this.... kinda like looking at 42 footers...<img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle>

Oscar
250WB#618 Lady Kay on the Chesapeake
<img src="http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/Images/familypics/Forumshots/wingonwing.JPG" border=0>

Edited by - Oscar on 09/06/2003 19:20:11

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 09/07/2003 : 05:47:41

Oscar, since I'm the proud owner of a new 12" Powerbook G4, I have some sympathy for your G5 lust. On the other hand. . . .

My guru Wendell Berry (Kentucky poet, novelist, essayist, farmer, and professor at UK) wrote a wonderful essay about ten years ago entitled Why I Am Not Going to Buy a Computer. It's worth the read, and while a 'puter is a necessity for my line of work, I've tried to adopt some of his advice. To wit:

1. each new computer I've bought over the years has been cheaper than the one that preceded it.
2. each new computer I've bought has been easier to use than its predecessor.
3. each new computer has been smaller and more portable (hence useful) than its predecessor.
4. as with cars, the most economical way to use a computer is to keep it for as long as possible, until it either dies and/or is completely obsolete/unrepairable. My G4 replaced a six year old Powerbook 1400, for which I could no longer buy serial port printers except on ebay. The 1400 replaced a Mac SE, which replaced a IIc (when Bill Gates finally rules the world -- and it's close -- I'll go back to quill and parchment).

As I read people talk about their lust for Swans and Hinkleys and other behemoths, I appreciate all the more the humble virtues of my 1985 C25, which sails as much or more than any boat in the harbor not because I am there so often, but because it's simple and easy to use and reliable and relatively cheap (you know, like a Mac!).*

Brooke

* before all the Wintel drones crank up arguments for how much cheaper PCs are than Macs, remember to compare (pun intended) apples to apples. Yes I know that I can get a good Dell laptop for half the price of my Powerbook. But start adding equivalent software and hardware, and the Dell price begins to climb. It turns out that my $ 1800 Powerbook (which included a free printer , DVD-RW and CD-RW, and a wireless card) outperforms a Dell that ends up costing $ 2600. It will read and write more Windows files than the Dell will, and the Unix-based OS is far more resistant to hacking and viruses than Windows XP. <img src=icon_smile_cool.gif border=0 align=middle>

Edited by - brooke willson on 09/07/2003 06:31:31

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 09/07/2003 : 10:07:43

Brooke,

I don't disagree with your viewpoint. Depending on what you do speed is a greater or lesser necessity. I do some audio work (putting all my 600+ cd's on a harddrive for easy transfer to the Rio that powers the boat/car/travel audio) and I also spend quite a bit of time archiving and manipulating photo's and running miscellaneous desk top publishing software. My G-3 Wallstreet with a $60.00 used 16" screen and an external keyboard and mouse does it all fast enough, especially after I souped up the RAM to 256M.
The only problem I run into is that the ol' Wallstreet did not come with USB or FireWire ports, so I'm plugging and unplugging two printers, a hard drive a palmpilot a digital camera and an MP-3 player in and out of a PC card with two USB slots......lots of restarts and If I'm not very careful she chokes......and then its another restart .....
So, I could use a machine that was designed to deal with that IO architecture, and no, I couldn't justify spending the money on a G5. Good news is that now the G4's will get cheaper.

However, when you see a Hinckley, or a vessel of similar pedigree, you stop and look and drool, and if someone would say "I'm sick of it, I'll trade you for your simple, easy to use C250 or C25" you'd do it in a hartbeat. Or, more realistically, when a boat of such quality gets old enough and shows up for sale for a fraction of it's original cost, you look at it real hard. Just like I'll get excited a few years from now when a cheap G-5 shows up on e-bay. It doesn't hurt to dream.

Meanwhile, I agree that the big mistake most people make is that they think they will become happy if they get that faster pewter or that bigger sailboat. That is a viscious cycle you do not escape from. Most happines is found in enjoying what you have. We should never loose sight of that. And to stave off the inevitable assaults on this musing about the material side of our existence, I'll state right now that the most important things we have are of course life itself, our health and our loved ones.
Ooooohhhmmmm.........<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Oscar
250WB#618 Lady Kay on the Chesapeake
<img src="http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/Images/familypics/Forumshots/sunglitter.JPG" border=0>

Edited by - Oscar on 09/07/2003 10:36:04

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 09/07/2003 : 11:50:04

Heh heh...

All this on a site dedicated to an activity in which 8 mph is considered quite a thrill.

Don't worry about going anywhere fast... you're already there.

Currently maintaining two holes in the water...'77 Venture 23 and new to the family,
'78 Catalina 25

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 09/07/2003 : 20:27:39

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> However, when you see a Hinckley, or a vessel of similar pedigree, you stop and look and drool, and if someone would say "I'm sick of it, I'll trade you for your simple, easy to use C250 or C25" you'd do it in a hartbeat. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Actually, I don't think I would. I couldn't afford the radically increased dockage, insurance, maintenance, and tax bills. I also don't want a boat I can't singlehand, since that's how I sail most often. Now. . . should someone offer to trade me a Pacific Seacraft Orion or small Island Packet or maybe one of the smaller Cape Dorys . . . I might bite. I have never believed bigger is better.

And, yes, there is a legitimate need for some people to have computers (or cars, or women) with greater speed. My Powerbook had gotten pretty painful on the internet, even given my modest needs.

I agree: count the blessings you have, and be thankful.

Brooke

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 09/07/2003 : 23:27:07

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
1. each new computer I've bought over the years has been cheaper than the one that preceded it.
2. each new computer I've bought has been easier to use than its predecessor.
3. each new computer has been smaller and more portable (hence useful) than its predecessor.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
So, if you wait long enough, you'll..... never have a computer!
<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
...It (Mac) will read and write more Windows files than the Dell will, and the Unix-based OS is far more resistant to hacking and viruses than Windows XP.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Not more resisitent... Just much less interesting to the hackers. They can bust Unix systems in an instant, and even do so to hack into the telephone network. But it's more "productive" to send out a virus that'll infect and propagate itself from Windows machines.

Dave Bristle - 1985 C-25 #5032 SR-FK-Dinette-Honda "Passage" in SW CT

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2003 : 06:22:03

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>So, if you wait long enough, you'll..... never have a computer! <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Dave, that absolutely is the plan! Move onboard, no TV, no computer (although I confess at that point the boat will have to have more room than a C25).

I'm not a computer scientist, but evidently it's not just that Unix systems are less prevalent/attractive to hackers. Windows XP has five portals open when it's online: OS X has one. That's a major flaw that Microsquish is trying to fix.

Brooke

Edited by - on

n/a
deleted

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163 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2003 : 08:52:17

The Newport, RI in the water Boat Show is on this week, Thursday through Sunday. I look on it as a visit to Fantasyland, or, what one can do if they win a good Powerball. One could also consider it shopping for a retirement home . . .

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2003 : 11:11:48

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
The Newport, RI in the water Boat Show is on this week... One could also consider it shopping for a retirement home . . .
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Over the Admiral's cold, dead body! <img src=icon_smile_dead.gif border=0 align=middle> For shows, I'll have to settle for Norwalk next week--just one dock with sailboats, usually including a couple of Catalina 3X0s, a Packet (retirement home), and a nice Sabre or two. I've even been known to climb aboard a Hinckley Picnic Boat and drool... What a piece of workmanship. Can you imagine pushing a little joystick sideways and having a 32' boat move straight sideways up to the dock? <img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>

Dave Bristle - 1985 C-25 #5032 SR-FK-Dinette-Honda "Passage" in SW CT

Edited by - dave bristle on 09/08/2003 11:12:35

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2003 : 12:47:24

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>Can you imagine pushing a little joystick sideways and having a 32' boat move straight sideways up to the dock? <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Did you see where they built one they built for Martha Stewart?

<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>

Oscar
250WB#618 Lady Kay on the Chesapeake
<img src="http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/Images/familypics/Forumshots/sunglitter.JPG" border=0>

Edited by - on

Charlie Vick
Captain

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USA
423 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2003 : 13:18:52

"I'll state right now that the most important things we have are of course life itself, our health and our loved ones."

...and our love for sailing!

Cvick
PanaceaII '81 C25 #2439 SRSK
Fort Smith, AR

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2003 : 15:06:47

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>...and our love for sailing! <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Well yeah....that goes without saying....sailing IS life.....<img src=icon_smile_cool.gif border=0 align=middle>

Oscar
250WB#618 Lady Kay on the Chesapeake
<img src="http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/Images/familypics/Forumshots/sunglitter.JPG" border=0>

Edited by - Oscar on 09/08/2003 15:07:50

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2003 : 16:18:18

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
Did you see where they built one (Hinckley Picnic Boat?) for Martha Stewart?
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Hmmm... Martha Stewart out on the water with a little joystick...

Better watch the horizon, Val and you other South Shorers! <img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>

Dave Bristle - 1985 C-25 #5032 SR-FK-Dinette-Honda "Passage" in SW CT

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 09/10/2003 : 09:02:26

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

Quote from www.apple.com

Oscar on 09/06/2003 19:20:11
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Trivia: We all have lives other than sailing. I used to be the product manager for Newer Technology, we were a major player in the Macintosh world. Mia Culpa; incompetence killed us. Needless to say I love my Macs. My on-board computer is a white iBook. I just want to know when I can get 802.11 on my lake!

Frank and Martha in Wichita KS. Lake Cheney

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 09/10/2003 : 09:08:24

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> 802.11<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

You mean WIFI?...you want a hot spot? Maybe, if there's enough enthusiasm you can set one up. What would the range be?
Your e-mail address still hints at a connection to the commercial mac realm .......?

Oscar
250WB#618 Lady Kay on the Chesapeake
<img src="http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/Images/familypics/Forumshots/sunglitter.JPG" border=0>

Edited by - Oscar on 09/10/2003 09:10:11

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 09/10/2003 : 13:16:37

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
[quote] 802.11<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

You mean WIFI?...you want a hot spot? Maybe, if there's enough enthusiasm you can set one up. What would the range be?
Your e-mail address still hints at a connection to the commercial mac realm .......?

Oscar

WIFI is the street name for the IEEE standards called 802.11, there are a,b, and g permutations. On water a person might go a quarter mile or so. I guess that means we all need satellite based units like the new phones. Imagine, GPS and internet both on the water. Cool. My screen name contains one of my email addresses, we Mac people like to support Apple so a lot of us pay $100/yr for a .mac account with some storage and other bells and whistles. My primary address is listed in the directory, or you can use my work address. I think I am fairly typical. Don't most people have several addresses.

Frank and Martha in Wichita KS. Lake Cheney

Edited by - on

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