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I just made a cool new Chartplotter

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asduffy
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/04/2013 : 18:14:56

The new 2013 Asus Nexus 7 tablet ($229) has GPS, I got Navionics all US and Canada for it ($15. Total cost $245. If all you are looking for is a very nice chartplotter you should check this out.

Alan Duffy

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9076 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2013 : 20:08:44

Ya, Garmin is getting in bigger and bigger trouble! iPhones in cars, tablets on boats,... I'd sell.

Edited by - on

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2013 : 22:35:54

Last year's model also had it. I used a Nexus 7 with Navionics as my planning device and backup plotter on my recent month long cruise (http://alexwetmore.org has photos and stuff).

I liked it, but a real chart plotter still has enough advantages to matter. Depth, real course heading (the Nexus 7 GPS is very inaccurate for this), good speed over ground and speed through water information are all beneficial. I sometimes used it just as a second display unit for my Raymarine e7d plotter, really helpful when keeping track of anchor position and depth from inside the cabin.

I like the Nexus 7 vs the iPad for this job because the screen is a bit easier to read in full sun and the $189 price would make it cheaper to replace if something goes wrong. However battery life when running Navionics is really terrible, around 4 or 5 hours.

Edited by - on

sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

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814 Posts

Response Posted - 08/05/2013 : 00:51:39

I use iPad with Navionics and iPhone with Navionics.

Hard to read iPad (1st generation) in the sun, but iPhone (5) seems better in the sun.

You make a good point about the price.

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 08/05/2013 : 06:24:18

So, should I have purchased this combination instead of the handheld Garmin 76cs and G2 chip that I paid roughly the same price for? Reading this, I feel like I screwed up.

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awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 08/05/2013 : 06:51:42

Advantages of a handheld GPS are that it will have better battery life and is weatherproof.

Advantages of using a tablet are that it has a much larger screen, has other uses around the boat (like an anchor alarm) and off of the boat (browser/e-reader) and charts are cheaper.

Advantages of a fixed marine chartplotter are that you have no battery concerns (it runs off of the house batteries), it is weatherproof, and it integrates with the rest of your instruments. I have AIS, Wind speed and direction, depth, boat speed through water, and autopilot integration with my fixed chart plotter. There is a second display at the front of the cockpit (chart plotter is at the helm) that is nice for racing. This is the type of integration that it's hard to do on a tablet.

Note that $15 gets you the phone version of the Navionics charts. It is $50 for all US and Canada charts that run at tablet resolution. The cheapest flavor of the Nexus 7 (in the old model that was 8gb and $199 or less) has plenty of storage for this purpose, you don't need the 16gb or 32gb versions.

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 08/05/2013 : 07:10:05

My Garmin is handheld and has a 2 1/2" screen.

Edited by - on

asduffy
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 08/05/2013 : 08:51:00

So If you wanted to go completely ipad and get away from a system like charplotter, you can get the garmin glo bluetooth gps. That unit with an ipad or iphone and the garmin mapping system is more accurate than most any chartplotter as far as gps goes. If you wantd to integrate all your systems into it you could also go to a DMK http://www.dmkyacht.com/overview You can get the gps version of this and smart nmea transducer and sensors. What this gives you is all your data over 802.11 and feeds into many nice apps.

However, Alex is right. At the end of the day a solid plotter that is weatherproof, runs off house battery, and easily integrates with all your other instruments is the most preferable way to go.

I have personally had a very different experience than some with the gps in this unit and in my galaxy s3. I spent a week in the san juans with my phone (no cell reception) next to a brand new raymarine plotter, never did the two have any discrepancies with location. However, I would never suggest that anyone completely rely on a tablet or phone gps. But if it is all you have or can afford, you can produce a great little plotter for not a lot of money that does a multitude of things.

John, I would not regret your purchase. That is a good gps unit. It is reliable, has true gps, and is weatherproof with long lasting battery life and can easily be plugged in (so can a phone or tablet). You can also use it on a computer or VHF with a nmea 0183 to add gps to. So you can get true dsc calling onto you vhf or very accurate gps fed into a nice, and often cheap, plotter software on a laptop.

Edited by - on

sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

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814 Posts

Response Posted - 08/05/2013 : 09:19:02

Agree with everything others posted above.

Wanted to share additional info: All of the iPad models that are WiFi + Cellular have built in GPS chips which are active even if outside of cell service coverage areas, and will work with the Navionics software. The Navionics also downloads all the chart data to the device and does not need an Internet connection to work.

Edited by - sethp001 on 08/05/2013 09:21:16

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 08/05/2013 : 12:55:25

I returned the Garmin to my local West Marine without a problem. Bought the Asus Nexus 7 for $199 at the other WM. As soon as I can figure it out, I'll load the Navionics app.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5895 Posts

Response Posted - 08/06/2013 : 06:36:11

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by awetmore
 Note that $15 gets you the phone version of the Navionics charts. It is $50 for all US and Canada charts that run at tablet resolution.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Alex, I need to buy the Navionics version that is suitable for a Samsung Tab 2 10.1" tablet. I assume that is the $50.00 version. Can you furnish a link to a vendor where I can buy it? How can I know that I'm buying the correct version for my tablet?

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 08/06/2013 : 07:20:00

Steve, Navionics.Com at the bottom of the page there's a link for the iPad store for Google Play. It'll take you to the location where you can find the app for your tablet I bought the $10 version.

Edited by - John Russell on 08/06/2013 07:20:54

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5895 Posts

Response Posted - 08/06/2013 : 07:53:03

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by John Russell
 Steve, Navionics.Com at the bottom of the page there's a link for the iPad store for Google Play. It'll take you to the location where you can find the app for your tablet I bought the $10 version.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Thanks John!

Edited by - on

asduffy
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 08/06/2013 : 08:37:37

There is two versions of Navionics, there is the regular version that works in both phones and tablets that is cheaper, $10 for US and $15 for US and Canada, and then there is Navionics HD for the tablet only, that runs $54 that covers US and Canada. I went the cheap way mainly because I wanted the app both on my phone and my nexus 7.

Here is the Google Play link, https://play.google.com/store/search?q=navionics&c=apps&hl=en

I should also be honest and say that, I sell garmin and raymarine plotters, maptech, nobletech and rose point for a living. So I deal with a lot of customers who are faced with a new $1000 chart plotter situation. I am still learning a lot of this stuff and it is interesting hearing all your feedback on solutions such as this.

My reason for posting this solution to this form (other than owning a 1977 C25 myself) was that I increasingly find that people with a c25 or c27 often tend to limit themselves to less remote sailing areas where I am at. Often they sail the lakes and puget sound in good weather and cell range. For them they are often on a budget and I will have them try this solution before spending $1000 with me on new equipment.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4303 Posts

Response Posted - 08/06/2013 : 18:33:52

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by asduffy
 There is two versions of Navionics, there is the regular version that works in both phones and tablets that is cheaper, $10 for US and $15 for US and Canada, and then there is Navionics HD for the tablet only, that runs $54 that covers US and Canada. I went the cheap way mainly because I wanted the app both on my phone and my nexus 7.

Here is the Google Play link, https://play.google.com/store/search?q=navionics&c=apps&hl=en

I should also be honest and say that, I sell garmin and raymarine plotters, maptech, nobletech and rose point for a living. So I deal with a lot of customers who are faced with a new $1000 chart plotter situation. I am still learning a lot of this stuff and it is interesting hearing all your feedback on solutions such as this.

My reason for posting this solution to this form (other than owning a 1977 C25 myself) was that I increasingly find that people with a c25 or c27 often tend to limit themselves to less remote sailing areas where I am at. Often they sail the lakes and puget sound in good weather and cell range. For them they are often on a budget and I will have them try this solution before spending $1000 with me on new equipment.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
So between Garmin and Raymarine, which would you say makes the best product (quality, features, etc...)? I have always purchased Garmin products but have noticed lately that Raymarine and Lowrance have some nice features too.

Sorry if this is an unfair question.

Edited by - on

Peregrine
Admiral

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830 Posts

Response Posted - 08/06/2013 : 18:45:40

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by asduffy
 The new 2013 Asus Nexus 7 tablet ($229) has GPS, I got Navionics all US and Canada for it ($15. Total cost $245. If all you are looking for is a very nice chartplotter you should check this out.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

You got a pre-release 2013 Nexus 7?

Edited by - on

asduffy
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 00:10:57

Gary, that is a hard question to answer. And I will leave it to others here to chime in. :)

Believe it or not I managed to get one from Best Buy... LOL. It was the only one they had. It is released, just very hard to get right now. I have been looking at it for a while and wanted it for other reasons than just this. It is a great device and my wife and I love it so far. I highly recommend it.

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 03:30:24

If weatherproofing is the ONLY thing giving the chartplotters the advantage... There is always the Sony Xperia
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-06-12/sony-s-waterproof-tablet-makes-a-splash-rich-jaroslovsky.html

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5895 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 04:19:15

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by shnool
 If weatherproofing is the ONLY thing giving the chartplotters the advantage... There is always the Sony Xperia
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-06-12/sony-s-waterproof-tablet-makes-a-splash-rich-jaroslovsky.html

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I was very interested in the Sony Experia but, as far as I can tell, it doesn't have onboard gps. That's why I opted for the Samsung tab 2 10.1.

You have to be very careeful when shopping tablets. Some have gps and some don't, even within the same manufacturer's product line. I liked Samsung's 8" tablet, but discovered that it doesn't have gps.

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 05:59:17

True, yeah didn't look to see if the xperia had GPS...
All the tablets I've used have them.. I had the 7310 Sammy, and the Sammy Galaxy Tab 2 7.0... that also has cellular in it, and is technically a corporate tablet (which nobody uses, and it only costs us $10 a month, so I figured WHY waste it?)...

I'll be buying the $50 version of Navionics probably for it, going for a long weekend in Oriental, NC in a week... brother's bringing his Newport 17, maybe we do some 'xploring.

Edited by - on

szymek
Navigator

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Canada
209 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 09:30:38

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Steve Milby
 

You have to be very careeful when shopping tablets. Some have gps and some don't, even within the same manufacturer's product line. I liked Samsung's 8" tablet, but discovered that it doesn't have gps.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

oh true. Just 3 weeks ago I bought Samsung Galaxy Note 8 with cellular. I use work phone for mobile number and don't have data on it... so i figured getting the Note with cellular will be my best option. I bought it as i spend way too much time commuting to work and having GPS was just super bonus for sailing - which i assumed it has stand alone GPS. Looking at the specs it has: A-GPS (3G/LTE), S-GPS(WiFi) + Glonass.

Isn't Glonass equivalent to GPS? If I buy the navionics charts will it work without cellular network?

Edited by - on

Feather
Deckhand

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1 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 10:14:52

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by asduffy
 The new 2013 Asus Nexus 7 tablet ($229) has GPS, I got Navionics all US and Canada for it ($15. Total cost $245. If all you are looking for is a very nice chartplotter you should check this out.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 11:14:21

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by szymek
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Steve Milby
 

You have to be very careeful when shopping tablets. Some have gps and some don't, even within the same manufacturer's product line. I liked Samsung's 8" tablet, but discovered that it doesn't have gps.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

oh true. Just 3 weeks ago I bought Samsung Galaxy Note 8 with cellular. I use work phone for mobile number and don't have data on it... so i figured getting the Note with cellular will be my best option. I bought it as i spend way too much time commuting to work and having GPS was just super bonus for sailing - which i assumed it has stand alone GPS. Looking at the specs it has: A-GPS (3G/LTE), S-GPS(WiFi) + Glonass.

Isn't Glonass equivalent to GPS? If I buy the navionics charts will it work without cellular network?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

It basically comes down to this: if your device has cellular capability, it'll almost certainly have GPS. If it doesn't, it probably doesn't have GPS.

I specifically bought Rita's iPad II w/ 3G because I knew it had GPS because I wanted to use it with Garmin's Blue Chart software (which it works well with, except you can't see the screen very well in daylight).

GLONASS is a Russian version of the US GPS system. I don't know if chart plotting software will use the position reported by it or not.

Since the GPS signal is independent of the cellular signal, assuming you have your charts pulled locally (meaning you don't have to depend on a data plan to get your chart data), you should be able to use your device w/o a signal.

Edited by - on

asduffy
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 11:43:56

This is what led me to the new Nexus 7, I needed GPS but had no intrest in cell. I was looking for around the $200 range and chose this. Here is a little info on the GPS chip in it if anyone is intrested in reading up on it more, however my understanding is this a true gps. Not A-GPS.

iFixit found the GPS chip:

ifixit.com/Teardown/Nexus-7-Teardown/9623/2

It's a good widely used one: Broadcom BCM4751 integrated monolithic GPS receiver.

Same chip is used in many Samsung phones and tablets, and also in Asus and Acer ones. If the antenna and the firmware implementation are correct it will be a very sensitive GPS, I expect at least 6-8 satellites indoors.

The research I have done on this chip leads me to believe it is as good as it's going to get in a device of this kind for now.

Edited by - on

sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

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814 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 13:27:47

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
It basically comes down to this: if your device has cellular capability, it'll almost certainly have GPS. If it doesn't, it probably doesn't have GPS.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

By law, any new cellular device sold in the US has a GPS chip. So if a device has cellular capabilities, it's reasonable to assume it has a GPS chip.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
If I buy the navionics charts will it work without cellular network?

Since the GPS signal is independent of the cellular signal, assuming you have your charts pulled locally (meaning you don't have to depend on a data plan to get your chart data), you should be able to use your device w/o a signal.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

If you buy a device with a built-in GPS chip (or you buy an external GPS receiver to connect to a device without built-in GPS), the Navionics software can work without any WiFi or cellular network service, because all of the chart data is downloaded to the device and stored locally on the device. So this will work well when sailing in remote areas "off the grid".

The Navionics software can also work as a simple chart on devices without GPS. It just can't tell you where you are.

Edited by - sethp001 on 08/07/2013 14:06:57

szymek
Navigator

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Canada
209 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2013 : 15:22:21

I'm happy to report that samsung galaxy note 8 has gps receiver. I dowmloaded free version of marine navigator, turned off wifi / mobile data and I got my position. Woohoo. Although I never intended to use it as chartplotter, I can use it as backup or on fishing trips.

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