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Catalina 25-Wing Keel

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jstevens
Deckhand

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3 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/03/2012 : 10:14:18

Does anyone know how many Catalina 25's with a wing keel were actually built and how many were built in each year? I am looking for one built between 1988 and the end of production,with a standard height mast. I would like to know how many are 'out there'. Thank you!

Jim

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9076 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2012 : 10:37:29

One suggestion: Go to the Owners list (at left), select the "old listings" link (there are more boats registered there than in the newer list), then select Catalina 25 Owners. You can then see a pretty good sample, in chronological sequence, and extrapolate from there.

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Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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1181 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2012 : 10:40:38

Using the [url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/email25.asp"]Owners[/url] list as a source, and assuming there were no gaps in the serial numbers, there were 314 C25's built between 1998 and 1991. No idea how many had tall or standard masts. You can probably review the owners list and get an idea of how many of each type is listed and get a ratio to apply to the overall number.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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4382 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2012 : 17:32:13

You realize the 1988 model is a crossover? Original deck design mixed with wing keel.

When we were looking for ours, I'd be willing to bet the ratio of what was up for sale was considerably lower than what was produced. Drove 600 miles one-way to get ours . . . and it's a keeper.

Edited by - OJ on 02/03/2012 17:43:24

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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4303 Posts

Response Posted - 02/04/2012 : 12:52:03

Where are you located?

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9076 Posts

Response Posted - 02/04/2012 : 15:45:56

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OJ
 You realize the 1988 model is a crossover? Original deck design mixed with wing keel...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Right--1989 was the first year for the last (and best) version.

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Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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1181 Posts

Response Posted - 02/04/2012 : 23:44:27

You guys! I keep telling you the 1978 was the best year for C25's but you never listen.
"You can lead them to the water . . ."

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jstevens
Deckhand

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3 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2012 : 10:07:56

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 Where are you located?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9076 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2012 : 11:18:40

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Sloop Smitten
 You guys! I keep telling you the 1978 was the best year for C25's but you never listen...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Oh... Ya. I forgot about that one.

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NautiC25
Admiral

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USA
957 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2012 : 12:31:44

I gotta admit, i'd jump on Confetti hull#1 if it became available.

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JimGo
Admiral

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USA
962 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2012 : 22:47:12

Yeah, there would be something about owning Hull #1 that would be pretty cool. Plus, we all know how she's been babied over the years!

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Arlington
Navigator

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USA
196 Posts

Response Posted - 02/08/2012 : 22:45:23

Stevens, It would seem that you could call Catalina and they could tell you for certain. Did you see the following in the Tech Tips?
Doug

by Larry Charlot
May 05, 1998
Catalina 25 #1205 "Summertime Dream"
lcharlot@jps.net

Here are some comments and advice to help you with shopping for a Catalina 25. The total production of C-25's was around 6,500. The first model year was 1976 and the last was 1991. Actually, the last "regular production" year was 1990; the factory produced a few more boats in 1991 for specific customer orders.

There were three keel types offered: Initially, you could order a boat with a 5' draft fixed keel or retractable swing keel, then in 1986, a 3' shoal draft wing keel was added as an option. The swing keel is made of cast iron, and these boats are not recommended for long term use in salt water marinas, since the salt water will eventually damage the cast iron. The wing and fixed keels are made of lead and are therefore non-corrosive. The fixed keel boats generally have slightly better performance than the wing keel or swing keel, and can point a few degrees closer to the wind, but they sit so high on the trailer that they're much more difficult to rig and ramp launch. The swing keel is probably the greatest percentage of the total production, and you see more of them for sale than fixed or wing keel boats combined. The swing keel adds some additional maintenance to the boat, as the cable and pivot hardware needs to be inspected periodically and replaced when worn. The pivot pin is 1-1/2" diameter bronze, much softer than the iron keel, so it erodes with time and repeated raising/lowering cycles. If the cable or pivot ever fails, the results can be catastrophic (especially if the failure occurs with the keel in the fully raised position), as the 1500 pound chunk of iron free falls out of control. On impact at the bottom of the swing, it can severely damage the fiberglass trunk, which could possibly result in the boat sinking, if the leakage rate was faster than you could pump or bail. I don't mean to scare anyone, it's just something to keep in mind. Inspect the swing keel every two or three years and replace the hardware as needed (these parts don't cost much, maybe $40 for a pin or cable).

In my opinion, the shoal draft wing keel is the all-around best choice, if you are not a dedicated racer. The height of the boat on the trailer is about the same as a swing keel Cat 25, so launching and retrieval is easy. The wing keel won't rust, even in a salt water marina, and there are no moving parts to wear out as with the swing keel. Also, the wing keel boats are the newest and usually best condition. The deck and cabin interior underwent a major redesign in 1986, with lots of small improvements, including the wing keel. The floor was lowered a little, since the wing keel doesn't require a trunk in the bilge as does the swing keel, so the wing keel boat has a little more headroom in the cabin. The only problem with the wing keel is expense: these were the least-produced of the three different keel types, so there are fewer of them for sale at any given time, thus the law of supply and demand makes them more expensive. The fixed keel boats are usually the lowest priced, but many of these that you spot in the classified ads turn out to be boat-only, with no trailer. WARNING: A new tandem-axle, 7500# capacity trailer costs about $4,800 (I just priced one last month at DHM Trailers here in Sacramento). Used boat trailers are about as rare as snowballs in the Mojave Desert in July, so don't count on being able to easily and quickly buy a cheap used trailer. If you see a boat without a trailer for sale, keep this in mind when negotiating price, if you intend to trailer the boat and not just keep it permanently in a marina berth.

Some other design items and features to watch for:

Gas Tank Locker. On pre-1982 boats, the outboard motor's fuel tank sits down in the lazarette on the port side of the cockpit. IMHO, this is a bad design, ... (go to this Tech tips post for a lot more good info)

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 02/09/2012 : 14:11:44

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Arlington
 by Larry Charlot
May 05, 1998
Catalina 25 #1205 "Summertime Dream"
lcharlot@jps.net

. . . The deck and cabin interior underwent a major redesign in 1986 . . . WARNING: A new tandem-axle, 7500# capacity trailer costs about $4,800 (I just priced one last month at DHM Trailers here in Sacramento) . . . <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">The deck/coach roof went through an even more drastic design change in 1989.

Today a new trailer can easily exceed $7,000.

Edited by - OJ on 02/09/2012 14:15:41

Dave Otey
Navigator

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USA
112 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 20:01:37

6031 was the last made in '91.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9076 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2012 : 22:23:31

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">...by Larry Charlot 
...you could order a boat with a 5' draft fixed keel... The wing and fixed keels are made of lead and are therefore non-corrosive. The fixed keel boats generally have slightly better performance than the wing keel or swing keel, and can point a few degrees closer to the wind...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Actually, the fixed (or "fin") keel draws 4', and was "naked" cast iron until 1982, when it was changed to fiberglass-encapsulated lead. There is no consensus on whether it outruns or outpoints the swing keel (which draws 5' when down)--the reverse just might be true by a very small margin. The sails and the sailor will more likely make the difference. The wing keels do have a slight disadvantage in pointing compared to a fin--I've sailed side-by-side--but they sail very nicely, especially for a non-racer.

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