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seabiscut
Deckhand

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USA
22 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/01/2011 : 21:23:13

We need to buy a new outboard motor, for our 25ft. Any one have a thought on which brand to buy? Looking at a Honda 4stoke 8. I would like easy pull start and quiet

Thanks

Joan
SK/"Hau Kea" Ut

Edited by - on

panhead1948
Captain

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345 Posts

Response Posted - 02/01/2011 : 22:38:10

I have an older 7.5 Honda runs great, start easy, and doesn't wheigh too much. Love it.KJ

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 06:52:10

Easy pull start and quiet operation probably will apply to most of the 8hp 4 strokes available today. Options to consider are shaft length (the longer the better), local service, and maybe weight. Shaft length may be horsepower dependent, in that 25" shaft lengths may only be available on 9hp outboards and up. A number of members here have availed themselves to the Association discount from Online Outboards which sells Tohatsu's and Nissans outboards. Apparently, small Tohatsu, Nissan, and Mercury outboards all share the same powerhead with the remaining parts being brand specific. A nice feature on the Mercury outboard is the integrated throttle/shifter. Rotate throttle one way for forward, twist it the other for reverse. Truly a one handed, no look operation.

Good luck in your search.

Edited by - on

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1773 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 07:42:56

Joan -- if you go to the archives and search for "outboards" you will find scads of threads providing more information than you can imagine on all types of outboards for our boats. While everyone has a preference toward brands (I have a Tohatsu) I believe the concensus is that the 25 inch (XL) shaft works best. Great information is available via the past threads that I am sure will provide the information you seek.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 09:20:44

I agree with Peter that the 25" shaft works better on the C25. Initially I tried a Merc 5 hp long shaft that I already owned, and while the power was okay getting in and out of the slip, I found that the 20" shaft would cavitate if someone went to the bow while motoring.
Onlineoutboards.com offers a discount to Association members. I bought from them a Nissan 9.8 with electric start and 25" shaft and absolutely love it. Small HP Nissan's are made by Tohatsu, so are Mercury's. In the 9.8 hp class the Tohatsu/Nissan motors are the lightest.
Originally, I wanted to get an 8 hp motor, which is plenty of hp for the C25, but it was not available from Tohatsu/Nissan with the 25" shaft, so I got the 9.8. (Electric start was for my wife, but as I said, I love it too, and with the alternator, it will charge the battery.)
The 6 hp "sail pro" model with manual start and 25" shaft weighs only 59 lbs, while the 9.8 weighs 93 lbs. It also costs $600 less.
If having a shifter on the tiller handle is important to you, look at the Yamaha and Mercury motors. For me that was not an issue, since the shifter on the Nissan is in front of the motor.
Good luck with your search. Check out Ebay, too.

http://www.onlineoutboards.com/Tohatsu-9-8-hp-Outboards.html

Edited by - dmpilc on 02/02/2011 09:30:26

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 10:00:09

The basic function of the motor will be equal across brands; they will all be quiet, reliable, and easy to tart. I like my Mercury's throttle/shift, but that is just personal preference. I have the Bigfoot model, and it does have the advantage of bigger gears, shafts, and bearings in the lower unit and more gear reduction so it turns a bigger prop at lower RPM, but it is also heavy. Balance features you like with cost and weight and any major brand will be a good, reliable pusher. As everyone says, a 25" shaft is desirable and more important than brand..

Edited by - on

Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1181 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 10:12:13

For a little over $2,000 (with the association discount) the Online Outboards Tohatsu 9.8 is a great deal. It comes with both electric and pull start so if you run the battery down you can fire it right up with just a tug. No need to remove the cover and wrap a pull cord on the flywheel. Since it is attached to your batteries it is constantly charging them while running. The 25" shaft keeps the prop in the water except in extreme conditions. If that's not enough there is no sales tax (for non-Tennessee residents) and they pay the shipping.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9075 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 10:22:50

I had the current model of the electric-start, high-thrust Honda 8 (now owned by "Voyager" Bruce Ross). It's heavier than the Tohatsu, and a little lighter than the Merc Bigfoot. It's exactly the same engine as the 9.9 except for valve timing, and its 4-blade, lower-pitch prop gives amazing start/stop thrust for maneuvering around a dock--similar to Yamaha's high-thrust models.

I like the Tohatsu/Nissan units, although they weren't on the market when I bought. I picked Honda partly because of the local dealer, and partly because the comparable Yamaha didn't have a pull-starter (unless you removed the cowl and unbolted the flywheel cover!)

For a small lake, the Tohatsu 6 (25") will work fine. If you want electric start and battery charging, look at the Tohatsu 9.8. If you're not worried about weight or a few hundred more bucks, Honda and Yamaha are outstanding.

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3439 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 10:29:15

I have a 2006 Honda 9.9hp, long shaft. It's great. It recharges the battery at 12 amps which is at a higher rate than most outboards, though, my solar panel is what really recharges my batteries since the outboard is rarely operated very long...mostlky just in and out of the marina and sometimes for 1/2hr - 1 hr if coming back when there was no wind. What I like best about it is that it has no manual choke, it's automatic and has behaved flawlessly. You mentioned getting the 8hp and that should be fine. But as what was said earlier, look to getting the long shaft.
Bear in mind that the Honda is not a lightweight such as the Tohatsu and so it is a bit harder to deal with if having to remove it, transport it and then re-installing it. It also is a lot more costly than a Tohatsu. So...those are things to consider.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9075 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 11:24:46

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OLarryR
 look to getting the long shaft.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">What he means is "extra-long". "Long" is generally specified for a 20" transom, and "extra-long" (XL) is for 25". We just want whatever is longest.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 02/02/2011 11:25:24

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 14:27:31

Also very important, what is the condition of your motor mount and what weight motor is it rated for (how many springs are on the mount)? Not knowing what year your boat is, if the mount is the older one with both arms (flat bars) next to each other, or the somewhat newer style (round bars with the handle between them but only 1 spring), you will want to upgrade the mount as well to handle the newer, heavier 4-stroke motors.
We had the latter style mount and it took the addition of a block and tackle to handle the old 88 lb motor that came with our boat. I replaced it along with the motor.
PS, Don't buy a Fulton 1810 or 1820 mount unless you put a 1" backing plate between the hull and the mount (from experience). Rather, buy the Garhauer mount that CD sells. It fits the C25 better and may mount in the existing holes.

Edited by - dmpilc on 02/02/2011 14:31:04

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 15:07:14

Because of the long reach for the shifter out the back pulpit I'd get the Merc with the integrated throttle/shifter.

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3439 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 15:58:14

As Dave Bristle mentioned, I meant to indicate that what you should get is the extra long shaft model - That's what I have.

In regards to outboard bracket sizing based on outboard weight, Catalina Direct sells the 2,3 and 4 spring Garhauer models. For the 3 spring model, the write-up indicates it works well for outboards 80-95lbs. I replaced my 2 spring existing bracket with the 4 spring model since the Honda 4 stroke is well over 95lbs. If you purchase one of the lightweight outboards that has a weight hovering around 80lbs and you have an existing 2 spring Garhauer bracket, then I rcmd you see how the existing 2 spring bracket works with the lightweight outboard. You may not need to change out the existing bracket. Here is a photo of my 4 spring bracket. More details regarding the install on my website. Photos on my website show a block and tackle on the starboard side of the bracket/outboard and I should explain why. That is just something I transferred over from the existing bracket. It may have been used by the PO to assist in pulling up the old 4 stroke outboard but i kept it not for pulling up the new outboard but as a safety if for some reason the outboard fell off the bracket. I really do not need it. The new bracket has a flange edge on the mounting plate that would prevent the outboard from sliding off and besides, I use the channel lock that captures the outboard handle clamps, so there is no way they can loosen...Hmmm ! Looking at the photo, That is the new bracket but old outboard. Photo taken just before I replaced it with the new 4 stroke. I replaced the bracket first...and then the outboard. I can tell it is the old outboard because there is some paint missing on the support arm and the handle clamps are not captured by the channel lock. My website has some photos of the new outboard.

Edited by - OLarryR on 02/02/2011 16:05:19

seabiscut
Deckhand

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USA
22 Posts

Response Posted - 02/02/2011 : 21:46:14

We have the 4 spring motor mount. Just installed last year. I am going to check Online Outboards. Everyone has given me great advice. keep them coming. Thank
Joan

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3439 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2011 : 04:27:05

In case you do not read my write-up on my website regarding my experiences installing the 4 spring Garhauer, I thought I would share some comments mainly for those that are considering installing a 4 spring model. First, the benefit of installing a 4 spring model if one has an existing 2 spring model Garhauer, is that the mounting bolt holes are an exact match and so it is just pulling off the old mount and installing the new mount utilizing the existing 4 bolt holes. Many add a piece of starboard on the outside of the transom and some also add it on the inside to provide a bit more reinforcement but otherwise the mounting is very easy vs having to redrill new holes thru the transom. The second thing is and it probably does not apply to those like you that already have had a 4 spring model mounted for a year but when I initially installed the 4 spring model, the springs are so strong in tension that after I installed my outboard (which weighs about 105-110lbs, I initially had some time getting the outboard into the lowest locking down position of the bracket. The springs tended to be a bit too much tension. Once in position, I had to apply significant foot pressure on the bracket handle to get the bracket unlocked from that position to raise the outboard. Once unlocked, the outboard/bracket would immediately raise on it's own about 6-10" before you then easily raised it into the upper locked position. What I did to relax the springs a bit was to leave the outboard/bracket in the lower down locked position after I was back in the dock area and I would leave it that way till I went sailing again a few days/week later. After doing this for a few weeks, the bracket was then much easier to get it into the lowest down locked position. Even to this day, to unlock the bracket to raise it, I apply very light pressure with my foot onto the handle since just hand pressure is still not quite enough to get it out of the lower locked position. The outboard still pops up a bit about 4-6" due to the spring tension and so even with a heavy outboard like the Honda, this 4 spring bracket is a good match. Thru the years, I have been very happy with the working of the bracket with the Honda but for most initially using the 4 spring model, you may have somewhat similar experiences.

Edited by - OLarryR on 02/03/2011 04:31:03

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2011 : 15:42:24

This is what the Fulton mount looks like:

Note that I used a 1/2" backing board. The mount actually works fairly well and is very strong, but I cannot use the very top setting; the handle touches the rubrail. So, I do have to tilt the motor to the shallow drive position to get it completely out of the water.
With the Fulton mount, in order for the handle grip to clear the rubrail so the top notch can be used, the mount needs to be a little bit farther away from the transom, hence the suggestion to use a 1" backing board.
The motor in the pic is the 5 hp Merc long shaft I tried first after installing the mount. Sitting in the boat alone at the stern, the cavitation plate was just barely in the water. Anyone going forward would raise it up enough to cavitate and not pee a steady stream of water.

Edited by - dmpilc on 02/03/2011 16:04:12

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9075 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2011 : 16:15:57

Good discussions about brackets, but Joan already has that licked.

Edited by - on

Boomeroo
Navigator

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Australia
129 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2011 : 18:27:48

I just purchased a Tohatsu Extra long shaft 9.8 2 stroke with charge coil because of fantastic experience with these over the last 10 years on various yachts. Always start 2nd pull Idle reliably .
HP is not an issue having used a 5 Hp on a 8 m (26 ft) keel boat for a year every Wednesday winds to 30 Kn
Modifications 1 Pulley on start cord to allow vertical pull
2. extension to Throttle ( 12 in of 2inch plastic pipe)
3.12inch extension to Gear change ( bit of electrical conduit bent)
4 Put Mounting Bracket on Sail slide so it (the bracket ) slides up the stern with a small tackle from the top of the stern rail .
Result no bending twisting or heavy loads and motor can be set very low for waves and yet pull very clear of water and fully tilted

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2011 : 20:05:10

OT
good to hear from you Boomeroo, and to see you on Homeports. I was afraid that you might have been swept away in the floods.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9075 Posts

Response Posted - 02/03/2011 : 21:59:20

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Boomeroo
 Modifications 1 Pulley on start cord to allow vertical pull
2. extension to Throttle ( 12 in of 2inch plastic pipe)
3.12inch extension to Gear change ( bit of electrical conduit bent)
4 Put Mounting Bracket on Sail slide so it (the bracket ) slides up the stern with a small tackle from the top of the stern rail .
Result no bending twisting or heavy loads and motor can be set very low for waves and yet pull very clear of water and fully tilted <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I think we need to see a photo of all of this... Sounds pretty ingenious!

Edited by - on

seabiscut
Deckhand

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USA
22 Posts

Response Posted - 02/04/2011 : 20:31:43

How do I get the Association deal with Online Outboards. I called and the man on the phone was very suspicious of me being in the Association. What is the protocol. We are going to get the Tohatsu 9.8

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 02/04/2011 : 20:48:18

You need to log in to the Member Association Area, using the name and password sent to you when you joined the Association. The link is in the upper right corner of the Forum page.

Edited by - on

Boomeroo
Navigator

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Australia
129 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2011 : 00:07:58

Only have 1 photo of Bracket on Slides and have failed my last 3 attempts to include photos
Notice that my outboard is on the port side and thus the Tohatsu gear lever lines up beside the tiller and gearchange extension runs thru under main track beside the tiller

PS for all up north its 40 deg C here today and blowing 30 knots so we rigged the etchell and then decided not to race too b hot

Edited by - on

Jay Schkloven
1st Mate

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USA
84 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2011 : 09:04:02

I purchased the Tohatsu 9.8 and recommend it and a new motor mount. Any mount that will handle the extra weight of the motor and has the necessary travel. If your mount is original to the boat, replace it an save yourself a headache. The spring tension on the new motor mount was so strong that moving the mount down so that I could slip the motor on from the back of the truck was impossible. All that was necessary was roping the 7 gallon jugs of water that I used to hold the tarp down over the winter to the mount and with little effort I was able to pull the mount down. Now lifting the motor from the truck bed to the mount was quick and was not an issue. The motor has given me no trouble but the carb. needs a spray of cleaner at the start of the season.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9075 Posts

Response Posted - 02/05/2011 : 10:53:14

Graeme, you're picking up the URL for Shutterfly's thumbnail (or "light-box" version) of your photo. Double-click that photo to get a full-sized version, and then right-click on that to pick up its URL/location/address.

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Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
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