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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 250 Specific Forum

Boom vang to the cockpit

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Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Initially Posted - 07/18/2009 : 08:20:53

I am interested in leading the boom vang control line back to the cockpit through a rope clutch. Having to go forward to adjust the vang is a hassle and leads to us to not using that control as effectively as possible. Has anyone modded their vang and led it back to the cockpit? If you have I'd like to hear about it and photos would be great. Thanks!

We cannot direct the winds but we can adjust our sails.

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John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2009 : 09:11:15

I've split the difference and installed the vang with the bitter end hanging from the boom. I can reach it from the first step in the companionway. Not ideal but, I rarely use the thing anyway.

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frog0911
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1349 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2009 : 10:41:23

Check Arylin's web site for his vang mod. I think you will find it will eliminate the requirement to add another block and clutch.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2009 : 18:52:11

I agree. Flip the vang so the tail is on the boom end.

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AADIVER
Admiral

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USA
966 Posts

Response Posted - 07/18/2009 : 19:25:48

I removed the Cunningham line, removed the cam from the vang, and now lead the vang line aft and through the port clutch. I feel vang adjustment more important than Cunningham adjustment.

Edited by - AADIVER on 07/18/2009 19:31:47

Nautiduck
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Response Posted - 07/19/2009 : 06:25:38

OK Frank, now I'm intrigued. You've got two sets of jib sheets and the jib halyard going across the pop top. What's up? Is one of those sets for the self-tacker? Also, do you have an "after" photo of the new vang setup? And who is the new member Dana Point Bob who describes himself as "Frank Farmer's mod mentor?" What intrigue!!

If the vang is reversed - cam end up - that would seem to preclude the ability to adjust the vang when the main is off to the sides, especially since the release pull would be up rather than down, correct?

I checked Arlyn's site as well. His idea of changing the cam angle is also a good one and would still allow the vang line to be controlled from the cockpit.

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AADIVER
Admiral

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USA
966 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2009 : 11:25:48

The line thru the pop top cam cleat is my mainsail dowser. The blue line is my regular jib sheet, the white one is my self-tacker sheet. I keep them both rigged. "Dana Point Bob" is my sailing partner. We both own identical 250's...well, not identical; I have many mods, he has only one, the self-tacker. We alternate sailing days, here in Long Beach, there in Dana Point. I'll post a pic soon with my vang "mod" thru the port clutch.

Edited by - AADIVER on 07/19/2009 11:26:33

Stu Jackson C34
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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2009 : 12:23:12

Vangs & cunninghams are both important sail controls. I would agree that the vang is used more often, and so I can understand the choice, but there really shouldn't be a choice, both should be there and able to work. Unless there is a super super super low stretch main halyard, the cunningham is very useful tool, and I don't think any of us has spent the $$ for that technology on main halyards.

I wouldn't recommend a sheetstopper on the vang, the best control is a cam cleat. We have a standup swivel cam cleat, Harken among others makes them, although a good fairlead with a well placed cam cleat on the coachroof would work, too.

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AADIVER
Admiral

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USA
966 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2009 : 18:03:34

My vang line now runs aft and secured by the port clutch:

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Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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3704 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2009 : 18:53:46

Thanks Frank!

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Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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2980 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 17:26:22

Randy is right, the cleat needs to be at the mast block to stay centered. Another reason is if the vang is equipped with a snap shackle to enable it to be used as a preventer, the cam equipped block needs to be the lower or mast block.

As Frog pointed out, I solved the releasing problem by adjusting the cam angle. I went slightly too far and now have to elevate the line slightly above normal waste high pull to cleat it but breaking it loose from the cleat is now very easy with a line slap.

After I modified the cam angle, I added a wire line and block to double the purchase of the vang... I'm thinking that with this addition, the angle of the cam on the block would not have been an issue because the problem with slapping the cleat loose could have been more an issue with the line hitting the coach roof before the line force could release the cam.

If I were doing this again, I'd add a wire block at the mast and a length of wire line running from the vang bail thru the wire block and then a thimble to either accept a clevis or snap shackle from the vang block. After doing this, there may be no need to adjust the cam angle.

It should be noted that there is plenty of height now for the line to be slapped and not dudded out by hitting the coach roof.

Edited by - Arlyn Stewart on 07/21/2009 17:42:27

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 19:31:18

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Arlyn Stewart
 Randy is right, the cleat needs to be at the mast block to stay centered....the cam equipped block needs to be the lower or mast block.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I disagree. My vang is flipped with the cam cleat on the boom end of the vang. The cam cleat angle is adjusted so that it is set with a somewhat downward tug and released by simply pulling the tail aft. Having it on the boom end puts the adjustment that much closer to the cockpit than if it were at the mast base making it so much easier to use. Even with the mainsheet all the way out, the vang tail is still near the centerline. I found it easier as well when its used as a preventer. (I learned this from Brooke...Thanks!)

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Nautiduck
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Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 20:13:46

Arlyn, I am intrigued by your wire block adding purchase. I can't tell from the photo exactly how it is rigged. Where does the wire go to as it approaches the lower block of the vang?

I already have a 12" cable line that raises the bottom of the vang. Slapping the coach roof is not an issue but sometimes the line is so tight that it is difficult to get it out of the cam.

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Arlyn Stewart
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2980 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2009 : 03:04:30

Randy, I can't remember how long the line is but it has a thimble on both ends with a wire block between. One end of the wire line is made to the upper boom shackle along side the upper vang block. The wire block is shackled to the mast eye where the lower vang block is normally fixed.

The lower vang block makes to the remaining thimble of the wire line and in my case is done so with a snap shackle so that the vang can be removed from the thimble eye and used as a preventer over at the baby stay eyes. When used as a preventer, the wire line is not in play.

It theoretically doubles the vang purchase though its own drag must be subtracted.

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Arlyn Stewart
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2980 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2009 : 03:32:19

Hi Don... I've tried it the other way with the cleat at the upper boom block but didn't like it. You are very right in that it is easily released with a straight tug requiring no line whip but setting it requires pulling at a point as if one were standing in the companionway and that angle requires pulling from a position on the coach roof when used as a preventer.

So, its simply a trade, easier to break the cleat and harder to make it compared to easy to make and hard to break.

I've found a position that is relatively easy to make and break and can be done from behind the wheel though without the cam angle change, the preventer [probably can't be broke loose easily (which admittedly is pretty important).

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AADIVER
Admiral

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USA
966 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2009 : 23:17:32

Arlyn, I assume you're not in favor of my vang "mod"; leading its bitter end aft through the port clutch. Why?

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Arlyn Stewart
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2980 Posts

Response Posted - 07/23/2009 : 16:34:51

Frank, a great many sailors run their sail handling lines to the cockpit. There must be a legitimate reason for them to do that or they wouldn't go to the expense and effort. It's not hard to see that doing so provides greater ease and safety and I'm not at all at odds with those who choose that course.

My only issue is with the often offered phrase, "led aft to facilitate single handed sailing" as it is certainly not any necessity to run sail controls to the cockpit to facilitate single handed sailing.

So... if I inferred in any way that your doing so was not a good idea, my bad. The only issue I might have with it is if your reefing lines and halyard are not also led to cockpit as I think it makes good sense to have them all in one location. If I'm not mistaken, all your lines are and hence it it makes great sense to have your topping lift there too.

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AADIVER
Admiral

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Response Posted - 07/23/2009 : 22:17:29

The topping lift is the only control line that's not led aft. I've never had to adjust it in the 4 years I've owned the boat.

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