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Kelly-Hanson Sails... ?

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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Initially Posted - 11/04/2008 : 08:12:19

Anyone try these yet?

Single reef main 4.6 oz cloth $475
Double reef main 5.0 oz cloth $575
150 Hank-on Jib - 6 oz cloth $605
Storm Jib $195

http://www.kellyhansonsails.com

WOTAM - '77 Catalina 25 SK/SR Sail Number 158

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 11/04/2008 : 09:18:44

What grade is the [url="http://macksails.com/sailclth.htm"]cloth[/url]?

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 11/04/2008 : 09:37:39

The ad says sailcloth is Dimension-Polyant dacron, weights as indicated above. 6 oz. for a 150 genoa seems heavy. Should be good for offshore use. My new Rolly Tasker 135 is an upsize to 5 oz. from the standard offering.

Edited by - dmpilc on 11/04/2008 09:56:29

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5895 Posts

Response Posted - 11/04/2008 : 10:48:24

Read the following thread from August, 2008 on Sailnet. Especially read the last post on the first page of the thread.

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/45966-contemplating-new-sails.html

Edited by - Steve Milby on 11/04/2008 19:21:00

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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4593 Posts

Response Posted - 11/04/2008 : 17:01:53

Proceed carefully!

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3442 Posts

Response Posted - 11/04/2008 : 17:21:05

Be careful when comparing the weight of one sailcloth to another. If they are made of different manufacturer's sailcloth or sailcloth grade, then it is like comparing apples to oranges. Challenge supplies Dacron to the majority of sailmakers. But Challenge has 4 or 5 grades of Dacron. The less expensive sailcloth requires a heavier weight material and is still much more prone to stretching than their higher grade Dacron matls. Structurally, all Dacron sails will probably last 10-20 years before they shred. But they will lose their shape from stretching much earlier in their life...some will stretch in just 2-3 years.

Dave provided a link to Mack sails which is one of a number of sailmakers that uses a higher grade Dacron, less prone to stretching. The Mack Sail website has excellent technical info and write-up to get a feel for understanding sailcloth.

Here is the link to Challenge if you care to check out the the tech data and performance curves of the various sail matls.
www.challengesailcloth.com

Steve - That was a great find - The bulletin Board comments regarding experiences with the Kelly-Hanson sail purchase. It is perhaps only one bad experience but would definitely make me want to consider other options.

Many would not want to get into the details of the sailcloth matl. If that is the case, then next best thing is go with what many others have purchased and recommend from years of experience.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 11/04/2008 : 17:32:16

Helly Hansen is famous, Kelly... not so much. Sailmakers from the plains and mountain states probably should not go for a national clientele. I use an Oklahoma sailmaker for lots of things but not for a mainsail. A Colorado sail loft... come on.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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4593 Posts

Response Posted - 11/05/2008 : 07:20:43

I did some more searching on Dimension-Polyant. It is a German company and the largest producer of woven sailcloth in the world. They have a production facility in CT. Neil Pride uses their products for J-22 and J24 sails. Interestingly, Mack Sails, Hood, and UK-Halsey, as well as Waters Sails and a host of others, are all listed on their website. According to a map on their website, sail lofts all over the US use their products. So, you have options besides Kelly Hanson if you want Dimension-Polyant's product. I don't know how it stacks up against challenge sailcloth.

Edit: At National Sail Supply in Florida (Rolly Tasker sails), a 5 oz main is $590, std battens, one reef, and a 4 oz. 150 genoa is $675, both tall rig prices. I bought a 5 oz. full hoist 135 from them last spring and have been very happy. Current tall rig price is $579. They were easy to deal with.

Edited by - dmpilc on 11/05/2008 10:03:45

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1773 Posts

Response Posted - 11/07/2008 : 19:58:29

Also consider Ullman/Ventura (CA) who supplies Catalina and Catalina Direct -- If you talk with them you may be surprised how affordable their sails really are -- I paid Ullman about what you are looking at for Kelley Hanson last year.

Edited by - on

TheSalt
Deckhand

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USA
3 Posts

Response Posted - 11/11/2008 : 19:48:54

My friend had a poor experience with this guy, ok sail but crappy customer support.

Sure, get a sail from this guy Hanson, but only if you have a good lawyer and a lot of money and time to spend dealing with the him... sorry I mean his lawyer. Read his other references below.

By the way, this guy runs a marine store. It looks like the loft is a new venture and it shows.

Check out these fine references...
http://www.doctorbeer.com/kellyhanson/
or
http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/45966-contemplating-new-sails.html
and here...
http://denver.bbb.org/WWWRoot/Report.aspx?site=33&bbb=0885&firm=90014051

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 01/02/2010 : 09:52:58

Update:
Kelly-Hansen was selected by Jacksonville University to supply sails for its Catalina 22 racing fleet! The notice looks to have been posted back during the spring or summer. Current ad for a C25 SR mainsail is about $500 base with leech line, 1 full batten, 1 reef, bag. I assume ingignia and numbers, etc. are extra. They are selling on ebay too.

http://www.kellyhansonsails.com/apps/webstore/products/category/71989

Edited by - dmpilc on 01/02/2010 10:02:58

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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5357 Posts

Response Posted - 01/02/2010 : 12:40:15

Just my 2 cents, so take it for what it's worth. I'm cheap mostly.

But your sails are your 'engine' - agruably the most important part of the boat. If you try to spend the minimum, you'll get an 'engine' that runs, but soon will start to underperform and you'll become disappointed shortly.

If you go for the "good-better-best" best quality from a reputable manufacturer, you are reasonably assured that you will be satisfied with these sails for a long time.

Even if you go for the 'better', you will be happier.

Just another point - since the jib or genoa is responsible for most of the horsepower on our boats, if you go "best" on the jib and "better" on the main, you could save a few dollars with less downside.

Edited by - on

skrenz
Captain

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USA
351 Posts

Response Posted - 01/04/2010 : 12:10:13

Anybody have anything to say about Island Planet Sails, http://www.islandplanetsails.com/index.html ?

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 01/04/2010 : 22:04:33

In my opinion, Island Planet Sails (Dave Benjamin) is a reputable sail vendor and I have recommended them in another thread on this forum. As I mentioned then, I bought a sail from Dave for our C-22 and had a good experience working with him. It is a Rolly Tasker sail. Between the 2 boats, C-22 and C-25, I have bought 3 Rolly Tasker sails, each one from a different company, Island Planet (C-22), The Sail Warehouse (C-22), and National Sail Supply (C-25: a 135 genoa). Had a good experience each time! No particular reason for using 3 different suppliers.

Edited by - dmpilc on 01/04/2010 22:12:41

islandplanet
Deckhand

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USA
11 Posts

Response Posted - 01/07/2010 : 12:49:34

Thanks for the kind words David.

In addition to handling Tasker sails we also use other lofts to produce a broader range of offerings including some medium and high tech sails. Tasker has pluses and minuses. I'd be happy to share insights offline. With many web based suppliers you don't get custom design work which can be a drawback for some.
If the price for a sail is really attractive ask the supplier to specify in writing that the cloth used is not second quality or other manufacturer rejected cloth. In my experience most of the really low cost sails are built with seconds.

Edited by - on

Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 03/23/2011 : 10:37:37

Many of these sail loft use the same manufacturer in China. They wont tell you that but in truth the main difference in most is just the logo. I purchased a new set of Sails from Lee sails in Portland and I save a ton of money. Here is a link to the type of sailcloth Lee uses.

http://www.sail-making.com/sailMaking.asp

Edited by - on

Sailorbill
Deckhand

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USA
1 Posts

Response Posted - 04/30/2011 : 21:00:17

I would be cautious about purchasing from Kelly-Hanson. They charged my credit card for a new sail back in December. So far I haven't received the sail and now I can't get a refund.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 05/01/2011 : 07:37:00

This is a typical situation from everything I have heard. I will never understand the search for the cheapest sailmaker, what a misplaced goal.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 05/02/2011 : 07:11:24

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Sailorbill
 I would be cautious about purchasing from Kelly-Hanson. They charged my credit card for a new sail back in December. So far I haven't received the sail and now I can't get a refund.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That'd be enough to scratch them from my short list.

Edited by - dlucier on 05/02/2011 08:03:49

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 05/02/2011 : 07:22:41

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Sailorbill
 I would be cautious about purchasing from Kelly-Hanson. They charged my credit card for a new sail back in December. So far I haven't received the sail and now I can't get a refund.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Call your credit card company. They often waive the usual 60-90 day limit for non-delivery or other flagrant issues. If you already called, ask to escalate the issue to a manager.

This is a good argument for trying to keep the local sail lofts in business.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2011 : 10:31:51

Sailorbill, was your issue with Kelly-Hanson ever resolved?

Edited by - dmpilc on 05/19/2011 10:58:57

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 05/19/2011 : 11:39:07

Over the years a thread like this has come along fairly often, the consensus usually recommends passing on the company. I have never seen a post about the sails themselves and the happy buyer.

Edited by - on

islandplanet
Deckhand

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USA
11 Posts

Response Posted - 06/06/2011 : 21:55:25

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Douglas
 Many of these sail loft use the same manufacturer in China. They wont tell you that but in truth the main difference in most is just the logo. I purchased a new set of Sails from Lee sails in Portland and I save a ton of money. Here is a link to the type of sailcloth Lee uses.

http://www.sail-making.com/sailMaking.asp
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

While many well known sailmakers share the same manufacturing resources, none use Lee Sails. There are a handful of large contract lofts that build the vast majority of sails for name brand and many independents brands.

Lee sells direct to consumers which is something that the better lofts don't do. The best lofts sell only to the industry which makes their life much easier with far less interaction required as everything is done electronically. Design files and all specifications (dozens of selections to make) are submitted electronically.

The reason the prices are lower are not some conspiracy. They use second quality cloth and other manufacturer rejects to keep their material cost averages down. It's a competitive industry. If Lee could magically supply the same sails for less, all of the major players would beat a path to their door. Quantum, Sobstad, UK, Banks, Elvstrom, Ullman - pick a big name - they would be sending business to Lee.

Edited by - on

sailtim
Deckhand

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USA
10 Posts

Response Posted - 06/24/2011 : 21:41:07

In spite of the negative stuff on the net, I went ahead and ordered a storm sail from Kelly Hanson . They told me it would be 4 weeks. After I waited 4 weeks I called them. they said it would another 4 weeks for a total of 8 weeks. I don't have a good feeling about these folks. If I get a sail I will be surprised. I feel like a real dumb you know what.

I wouldn't recommend these folks based on my experience

Edited by - on

Alan Clark
Captain

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406 Posts

Response Posted - 06/25/2011 : 04:41:12

We have ordered Sails from Doyle Sailmakers- Detroit- Al Declerq- for both our Catalinas. We found there was little price difference, and it has been made up many times by service. ie: questions answered, minor touch ups in the winter etc. The sails have been what is promised and delivered on time.A friend who owns a Catalina 30 has also done the same thing with the same results. They are not building the 50K sail but they understand that service is what its about. They have also came and met with our club and gave talks on sail trim etc.
IMHO you get what you pay for..

Edited by - on

sailtim
Deckhand

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USA
10 Posts

Response Posted - 06/26/2011 : 20:36:29

From my personal experience, I would not worry about the sail cloth, I would be concerned about doing business with this loft. There is a great deal of chatter about negative experiences with Kelly-Hanson Sails in Colorado.Like a dummy I didn't pay attention to the complaints.
I was wrong. I ordered a storm sail from them. Less than $300.00 was a good bit cheaper than our local loft. This is about as simple of a sail as you can get so I figured that it would be no big deal.

They told me it ship in four weeks. When that time passed, I called them a couple of times and finally connected. The dude on the ( very unprofessional) told me it would be 4-6 more weeks. "Too busy" was the reason. Didn't even act like it was any big deal and didn't seem interested.

Their web site is deceiving. They look legitimate.

I have no clue if or when I will get this "no big deal" sail.

Tim

Edited by - on

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