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Rant: Repair shops...

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Initially Posted - 10/04/2007 : 12:15:12

So quite a while back I bought my little 4hp Mercury Mariner along with an Avon 3.15 for about $800 total. Killer deal as far as I was concerned and I still think that. We've never really had occasion to use the outboard, but the PO showed me that it ran, and was still peeing properly when I bought it. So, months go by, we still never use the outboard, but we want to take it with us on a trip attached to the Avon. I go to do some basic checks on it before bringing it to the marina, and I notice that it leaks gas from what I think is the carb float when I tilt it forward on the stand. Last thing I want is it dripping gas the whole time it's being towed behind the boat, so I decide to take it to a shop to have it repaired.

I call the shop up, and I have to make an appointment to bring it in for about a week later. This particular shop was chosen because it's close to my office and I was impressed by the number of course completion certificates on their wall when I'd been in there before. I'm surprised by the need to make an appointment but figure they've just got their bookkeeping in good order and they know they'll have time free to work on the engine when I get it there.

I was wrong...

When I dropped it off, the guy who helped me get it out of my truck said it should be done by "early to mid next week", "unless you're in a hurry?". I thought, nah, don't need it right away, next week is fine & told the guy so. Second mistake (first was bringing it there in the first place).

A week later I call them up asking about it: "let me see if I can find the work order..." "it doesn't look like the guys have gotten to it yet, is next week OK?" Sure.

A week+ later, I go by to pick it up assuming that it's long since been done. "who told you that it was done?" "well, they must not have checked the schedule, we only ordered parts for it a couple of days ago" You mean 8 days after I brought it in was the first time you even looked at it?

A bit less than a week later, I call again about it: "we ordered parts for it last week, they'll be here tomorrow, and your engine should be done that afternoon" So I go by the following afternoon... "who called you to let you know it was done?" No one, I was told yesterday that it'd be done today. "who told you that?" The guy I think is the owner strolls out of the back and says "probably me". He's apologetic, says the parts haven't come in, and he's short of mechanics, but it'll "definitely be done by early next week"

So I called yesterday and spoke to a receptionist..."it looks like we ordered parts for it a while back"...yes, more than two weeks ago... "did anyone call you to say it was done?" No, your owner told me it'd be done "early this week". "Oh, well, I don't know what the status is" You've had it for a month, it's probably covered in spider webs. "well would you like me to find out more for you" YES "OK, I'll do that & get right back to you"

That was yesterday afternoon, still waiting for that call...

Grrrrr

David
C-250 Mainsheet Editor

Sirius Lepak
1997 C-250 WK TR #271 --Seattle area Port Captain --

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3429 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2007 : 12:35:17

This sounds very typical of a lot of shops. The only reason I can think that they get away with this is because there are not many places to go and many are just as efficient as they are.

Just a small rant but for my 2006 Honda, I was going to change the lower unit oil out and to do it by the book, you need an adapter to screw onto the bottom hole and onto the oil hose to pump the oil in. That adapter.....you would think that they would have this part in stock. They just did not start selling Hondas...they have been selling them for quite some time and granted not everyone services their own motors but a little stinkin adapter that is needed for every oil change would seem they should have plenty in stock. they had to oreder it and I also got same sort of responses with each time being told they did not receive it yet. if you ordered it on the web, you would have it in 4-5 days...why does it take them 2-3 weeks or more ??

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2007 : 14:40:46

I have a '98 Honda OB. I changed the lower unit oil by following the instructions in the manual AND by purchasing oil in a container with a conical squirt spout. If you buy gear oil in a conventional container, you will have to buy the adapter. Which is nothing more than a plastic nozzle.
You can use any container that can squirt oil, and completely fit into the fill hole.
The Honda brand oil containers do not have the nozzle, but most marine places sell appropriatley rated oil in containers that have nozzles.
In Canada, they are sold at Canadian Tire. I've also seen them at Target stores in Washington.

Remember that lower unit oil is injected into the lower hole until it comes out the top hole. It doesn't take much. A one quart (litre)container will last for many oil changes.

I would have taken my OB into the shop to have them do a tune-up but last spring they were booked two months in advance. They sold me all the parts and answered all my questions. I had to drive all the way across the city, but the drive was worth it. I've had nightmares with small engine repair shops - they are often manned by under-achievers. The Honda dealer here is very good, but way too busy.

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3429 Posts

Response Posted - 10/04/2007 : 22:42:40

Not having the right adapter, I did use a plastic oil bottle (believe sold by Mercury) and it had a circular tip. I shoved it into the lower hole and started to squeeze the bottle. But at some point as the static head rose in the lower end, the outflow around the plastic oil container tip was starting to become significant. I wound up reinstalling the lower screw and then finished the fill-up with a small oil pump hooked up to tubing and thenwith a smaller itty bitty tube at the end which I inserted down thru the upper hole - hoping to minimize any air pockets. Believe it worked out fine.

Now I have the Honda adapter (believe it is brass) for the lower end.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 10/05/2007 : 07:37:35

I have a Honda as well. I use an oiler can with a plastic tip on it's flexible spout. I trimmed the spout tip a little and fill from the top. It works great.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 10/05/2007 : 08:23:31

David,

You pretty much described the chain of events that I went through this past spring when my motor was in the shop. I dropped it off early in the week and was told they'd have me back on the water by the weekend. When I inquired of the status on the weekend, I was given the "parts on order" routine. In the second week, I was again given the "parts on order" brush off only to discover that there was a mix up and the parts were indeed NOT on order. After actually ordering the parts, I inquired again and was given the "one of the parts is on vendor backorder" with no expected delivery date.

Anyway, after getting rather flustered with them, that day they drove across town and picked them up from another boat shop, installed them, and gave me my motor. The labor time on the bill was only 1.5 hours but I think they charged me for 3 weeks storage!

Edited by - on

PZell
Admiral

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USA
548 Posts

Response Posted - 10/08/2007 : 13:16:40

Had a delay last spring on parts for my Mariner. The shop has done good service for me. The story was that they were not a Mercury dealer/service shop so they get the run-around on their orders that go first to dealers.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 10/08/2007 : 13:38:46

Just an update, I called the shop again on Thursday afternoon in the vain hope that it might actually be fixed by then. I actually spoke to the mechanic who was working on it which was a breath of fresh air. She knew all about the work that was being performed and exactly what still needed to be done. She'd ordered the parts that were necessary and was still waiting on them from Mercury. She was apologetic but I could sense her frustration as well. At least now I know who to to ask for regarding the engine, but the upshot is, I still don't have it back, and she didn't know when it would be done.

Edited by - on

bbriner
Captain

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349 Posts

Response Posted - 10/08/2007 : 16:20:48

Me too. Last year we were just heading out the marina and instead of turning left to go out through the south exit we went right, through the north exit. We had a westerly that was blowing like stink and before we knew it we were heeled way over and the engine (on the starboard side) got drowned while it was running - which is NOT a good thing to do as water is not combustible. I tried my best to repair it but didn't get anywhere so I took it in to the local shop (where the PO purchased it). A week and half later the mechanic calls me and says that he has a couple of hours into it and he needs to order some parts and when they are in he'll need couple more hours to finish up. Later that week I get a call from the shop saying it's done, and, oh, btw, the total due is $875.00!!! Well, I went pretty ballistic on the guy, after all this is a 5 year old 6HP OB that I could probably replace new for $1000 - why in the world would he think I would be willing to pay that much for a **repair** bill. Now no one had said anything to me about that kind of money and if they had I would have said no way. I also knew from my earlier call that it was the only OB they had in the shop. So it seemed to me that I was basically subsidizing their shop since they didn't have any other work to do, and all boat owners are rich and can afford it, right? Wrong!! Based on what I was told earlier, and using their published labor rates, parts and labor should have totaled around $400, which is what we finally settled for. An expensive mistake. Turn off the engine before heeling!!

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3429 Posts

Response Posted - 10/08/2007 : 16:57:53

Bill - You talked them down to $400 ! I would say this is excellent. Granted it's $400 but you really were successful in your discussions.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 10/08/2007 : 17:32:20

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Larry: and, oh, btw, the total due is $875.00!!! <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I forgot about this part of the story...

So, when I first called them, I was given an estimate of $250 to do all the repairs & maintenance I was requesting. This seemed a bit high to me, but what do I know, this is literally the first time I've ever taken an outboard in for repairs.

Then, I made the appointment and showed up with the engine. I spoke to the same guy I think is the owner, and asked him what he'd estimate the work at (I learned to play dumb with things like this a long time ago), he said "oh, I don't think it'd be much past $125, maybe a bit more, do you want us to give you a call if it goes above that?". I'm thinking to myself "I like your estimate way better than whoever I talked to the first time" and said "great, let's get it going, and give me a call if it should get near $250".

I have no idea what the bill's at, but they've had it for just shy of a month now, I'm probably getting charged for cobweb removal & dusting.

What I am sure of, these guys are never going to call me for anything. Even when I was talking to the mechanic last week, she said, "why don't you give us a call next week" to which I replied "It'd be nice, just once, to get a call from you guys instead" To which she just laughed. I'm not holding my breath.

Edited by - delliottg on 10/08/2007 17:35:20

piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 10/08/2007 : 18:18:14

David, I understand the 1st guy said $250 but if guy you took it into said not much past $125, why did you say call me if around $250? I would have said, call me if over $150. Either way, better find another place to take it to.

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bbriner
Captain

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349 Posts

Response Posted - 10/08/2007 : 19:42:10

David - yes for sure tell them to call if it is over $125. Don't give them a blank check. That was my argument - I had put down a required deposit of $65 (1 hour). The mechanic led me to believe that I was facing ~4 hrs worth of work. Then when they tried to charge me for nearly 12 hours of work I had to protest (vehemently). Luckily the shop foreman was an honorable guy and agreed with me. Would you let your car repair place do anything they wanted for any price?

Edited by - on

piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 10/09/2007 : 13:01:25

Bill, I agree. I wonder what everyone else pays per hour. I am in Newport Beach, CA and my honda dealership charges $75 per hour and said it would take about 2 hrs for annual tune up. And for $40 more they will pick up and return engine on my boat, which I am gonna do.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 10/09/2007 : 14:34:17

I don't have my bill handy, but I think I was charged around $65.00 per hour.

Edited by - on

At Ease
Admiral

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672 Posts

Response Posted - 10/11/2007 : 16:42:28

If at all possible, and not too technical or difficult, I do everything on my boat in the way of maint/repairs myself.

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piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 10/11/2007 : 18:00:44

Bert, If I were 20 years younger and had the time, I would too. Unfortunately, I only have weekends and I would rather be out sailing than repairing/fixing,etc. But if it requires less than an hour, I will probably do it myself. I am not really lazy, but my time is more important.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 10/18/2007 : 19:05:35

So now for the rest of the story...

About a week ago, I called the shop to check on progress, if any. They still didn't have the parts in and didn't know when they'd be in. I asked the mechanic if I could help locate parts for her. She thought this was a great idea so I told her I'd find them, get them ordered & give her a call back.

Finding the parts took less than five minutes, no exaggeration. I just keyed the part numbers into Google, and located a repair shop in Houston that had all three parts in stock. Ordered them and gave the repair shop a call back:

"hi, may I speak with Erica (the mechanic)?"

"sure, let me find her...nope, she's gone home"

"can I leave a message or does she have voice mail?"

"no voice mail, but I'm her boss, I can take a message for you"

"great, I've ordered the parts for my engine that you guys have been having a hard time sourcing, they should be delivered early next week. Erica said she could have the engine back together in less than a day once she had them"

Silence, then...
"so what am I supposed to do with the parts I've ordered when they come in?"

"dunno? send them back or stock them for the next customer that brings in the same engine"

A long diatribe ensues about how diligently he's worked to get these parts for me, how I've got a bad attitude, and how he's just going to just slap the engine back together & I can come get it... Oh, and something about a train wreck at one point causing him to lose a full load of repair parts, I'm not sure how this pertained, but he was on a roll.

I patiently explain to him that he'd had my engine for over a month, hadn't called me once to let me know what was going on, and the only person who'd been helpful in his shop was his mechanic who seemed caught in the middle. I also explained that it was this same mechanic who thought it was a good idea for me to help find the parts and I wasn't sure how that entailed an "attitude".

Another monologue about how the parts had been invoiced and were definitely on their way, and his mechanic should have known better.

I explained that this wasn't really my problem, all I wanted was my engine repaired & back in my hands. I told him that since he'd finally gotten invoiced for the parts, I'd cancel my order and he could install his parts when they showed up. He agreed with this and the call ended.

Monday afternoon, about 16:45 I get my first ever call from the shop, the engine is done. I thought this was odd, since it was unlikely that he'd gotten his parts in by then since I know by now that he gets parts on Wednesdays. Anyway, I go down to pick up the engine. First the manager (not the owner above) tries to give me a 4hp 4-stroke Tohatsu LS (a much nicer engine than mine), which I'd love to have except for the LS part. Then he can't find my engine anywhere in the shop. We look around for 10 minutes or so and the owner (who's keeping a low profile) tells him it's right inside the garage door. We look, and there it is. I sling the engine into my truck, sign the credit card slip and head out figuring that chapter of my life is over.

I was wrong...

A day later, I get a phone call from the mechanic, it seems that my engine is still in the shop, and the one sitting in the back of my truck belongs to someone else, it just has my cowling on it...and it doesn't run. She's extremely embarrassed and needs to get the engines swapped out. This seems like an honest mistake to me, and I've never had any animosity toward her in the first place, so I don't give her too hard of a time about it. So I tell her she can come pick me up at my office, which is only about three blocks from their shop, and drive us over to where my truck's parked, about six blocks away and do the swap.

"um...I can't do that, I could meet you over at your truck"...

...um...so let me get this straight, you made a mistake, and need my help to rectify it, but you want me to walk twelve blocks in the rain to do so? If that's what you want, you can meet me at my truck when I'm done with work.

She showed up 15 minutes later with her manager driving (I'm guessing the boss was still keeping a low profile), they gave me a ride over & back to exchange engines, and I hope to never-ever-ever hear from that shop again.

Oh, and those parts? They never showed up, he bought after market ones to replace them.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 10/18/2007 : 19:35:43

hmmm

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Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
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