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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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New Lifelines

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Bladeswell
Captain

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USA
490 Posts

Initially Posted - 09/25/2017 : 12:19:10

Hello Again,

In the next couple of weeks I will be installing new lifelines and stanchions. My question is about where best to attach the bow end of the lifelines. Up at the top of the pulpit at the attachment rings already there or should I mount them down at the bases to maybe make tacking the headsail easier ? Your thoughts will be most welcome. Thanks again.

Bladeswell

C25 TR FK Hull #973 1979 L-Dinette. So.Cal.

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4017 Posts

Response Posted - 09/25/2017 : 16:35:05

My 87 has them attached at the base. Were early years attached at the top??? The only reason for Catalina to change them to the base that I can think of is to keep the attaching hardware, turnbuckles, Cotter pins from rubbing or catching on the sail. Just my guess.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

Bladeswell
Captain

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USA
490 Posts

Response Posted - 09/25/2017 : 17:59:33

Hello Again,

The attachment points on my bow pulpit are mounted at the aft ends of the top rail. Sort of welded rings, just not round. I would guess that my pulpit is original.

Bladeswell

C25 TR FK Hull #973 1979 L-Dinette. So.Cal.

Lee Panza
Captain

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USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 09/25/2017 : 22:04:57

Attaching the fwd. ends of the lifelines high on the pulpet provides better safety for the foredeck worker. Attaching them low, near the bottoms of the pulpit legs, allows a low-cut genoa to pass over them uninterrupted, for more efficiency (less room for air to pass beneath the foot, and a smooth sail at the foot). A cruiser, especially working the foredeck while sailing single-handed or short-handed, might be inclined to prefer the former, while a hard-core racer with a hanked-on deck-sweeper genny (tacked all the way down at the stem fitting) might be predisposed toward the latter.

Before I had my new jib made I raised my furling drum over a foot above the stem and had the sail cut shorter. The foot of the sail now rides uninterrupted over my high-mounted lifelines, so I can see under it better in the congested waters of SF Bay; I never felt safe with my old deck-sweeper. Also, I enjoy the view better now when I'm out day-sailing for fun. It was necessary for me to add fittings to the pulpit rails to attach my new lifelines up high, because the boat came with the original lifelines attached down low.

Diff'rent strokes...

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4017 Posts

Response Posted - 09/26/2017 : 08:40:59

I would point out that if you choose to attach them low, They attach to the forward legs of the pulpit, Not the rear.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

Bladeswell
Captain

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USA
490 Posts

Response Posted - 09/26/2017 : 09:22:01

Back Again,

Thanks again guys. I think I will opt to go low. I did notice in pictures I've seen that they were located on the forward legs. Didn't know why and still don't but I figure there must be some reason so I will follow suit and do it the same. Again, my thanks.

Bladeswell

C25 TR FK Hull #973 1979 L-Dinette. So.Cal.

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5894 Posts

Response Posted - 09/26/2017 : 12:26:58

FWIW, the original sales brochure shows them attached at the base of the forward pulpit legs, and that's the way I remember my 1981 was rigged. A decksweeping racing jib is trimmed inside the lifelines when sailing closehauled. When on a reach, it's outside the lifelines. The sail rubs on the pulpit on a beam to broad reach, but the smooth SS tubing doesn't abrade the sailcloth significantly. My jib showed no wear at that point after 23 years of racing and cruising.

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

Lee Panza
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 09/26/2017 : 21:32:58

Steve, you've got me curious now: if the sheets are led through blocks on the tracks mounted outside of the lifelines, how can you switch to sheeting inboard of the lifelines? Or vice versa if the tracks were mounted on the side decks as I've seen on some boats?

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5894 Posts

Response Posted - 09/26/2017 : 22:55:29

quote:
Originally posted by Lee Panza

Steve, you've got me curious now: if the sheets are led through blocks on the tracks mounted outside of the lifelines, how can you switch to sheeting inboard of the lifelines? Or vice versa if the tracks were mounted on the side decks as I've seen on some boats?

You're right. The newer C25s were sheeted inside the lifelines, but not the older ones. I see in this pic that the lifelines were attached to the top of the pulpit.

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

Lee Panza
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 09/28/2017 : 07:41:32

Could be my imagination, but it kind of looks like a very slight bend inward where the sheet crosses the lifeline. Maybe it's sheeted so tightly that the clew is inboard of the lifeline. I just wonder how attractive a picture it would have been for the sales brochure if the boat was bearing-off and the sail was folded over the lifeline. Guess it wouldn't matter much to the couple in the cockpit; they don't appear to be seriously focused racers, although the boat is making way in obviously light breeze. But if a sheet is led inboard of the lifeline, wouldn't it bear heavily on the lifeline when the sail is eased out?

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

Edited by - Lee Panza on 09/28/2017 08:06:13

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5894 Posts

Response Posted - 09/28/2017 : 09:08:54

The sail is inboard of the lifeline and I think the clew and sheet also have to be inboard of it. The lifelines and genoa track and sheets on my C&C 35, as well as on many of the boats I crew on, are rigged the same way as the ones in the photo. When closehauled, the sail and sheet are inside the lifelines. On a reach, the sail and sheet are eased outside the lifelines, and the sheet lays on top of the lifelines. When the reach is such that the sail hangs outside the lifelines, the sheet doesn't really lay heavily on the lifelines. I think the reason is because the pressure on the sail when reaching is considerably less than when closehauled, and the direction of the pull on the sheet is more forward than it is outward.

The lifelines on my C&C are original, and 34 years old (and due for replacement) but there's no significant indication of chafe on the lifeline covering from rubbing on the sheets.

I think the jib in the photo is eased slightly to keep the boat moving in light air. If the sheet looks slightly bent, I think it's bent slightly outward over the lifeline.

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9074 Posts

Response Posted - 09/28/2017 : 11:57:42

My '85 had the lifelines mounted low and forward, and sheeting was outboard. My roller furling made the tack of the sail maybe a foot higher than in the picture, and the sail was probably cut with a somewhat higher clew to allow the foot to wrap in a smoother spiral when furled (and for visibility). The sail lay on the pulpit when eased, but the foot was essentially unbent when close-hauled, as I recall.

Also, as the sail is eased on a reach or run, because of the angle of the forestay that it rotates around, the clew will be higher the further it is eased, which could help ease pressure on the lifeline with inboard sheeting.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 09/28/2017 12:02:50

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 09/28/2017 : 14:06:17

quote:
I've seen that they were located on the forward legs. Didn't know why

Attaching the lifelines to the forward legs gives tolerable height until you are within reach of the pulpit.

Dave B. aboard Pearl
1982 TR/SK/Trad. #3399
Lake Erie/Florida Panhandle

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5345 Posts

Response Posted - 09/28/2017 : 14:12:20

On Passage I actually added 8-10 more inches of genoa height using a line between the tack and the furler. I raised the head of the sail about as high up the mast as it could get since I want to avoid he foot rubbing on the lifelines and to get more air (higher up).
I did have to wrap a line to tie the tack to the furler body to prevent the jibsheet from pulling against the luff tape. This keeps everything in place. It's a little thing but it prevents chafe.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain � Milford, CT

Edited by - Voyager on 09/28/2017 14:15:16

Lee Panza
Captain

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USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 09/28/2017 : 21:41:51

I may as well toss this into the mix at this point. As I mentioned earlier, I had raised the drum of my furler and had my new headsail cut shorter, sacrificing a significant amount of drive for better visibility beneath the sail. Here's a snapshot of what I did.

The large turnbuckle-like apparatus is a Johnson Handy Lock 02 Series Turnbuckle. It allows for quick release of tension when I want to lower the mast (it's more convenient than easing the turnbuckle on the aft stay). Since I'm going to be trailer-cruising the boat soon this is something I'll have to do with regularity. It would also allow me to adjust the cant of the mast, although I haven't felt a need to do that. But mainly it gets the drum - and, therefore, the tack of the headsail - up off the deck so my view ahead is much improved. It certainly wouldn't appeal to a racer, but I enjoy my casual sailing more this way.

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

Edited by - Lee Panza on 09/28/2017 22:10:29

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1768 Posts

Response Posted - 10/01/2017 : 06:39:13

Mine are attached low and forward and in every boat I have owned that had lifelines I have set similarly so the head sail can tack easier.

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT

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