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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Help with Navigation wiring going to Mast

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whitlecj
Deckhand

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11 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/21/2011 : 06:40:21

Hey guys. I bought an '85 C25 about six months ago. When I bought the boat the previous owner said the steaming light and anchor light on the mast were not working but that he knew they had power to them so the bulbs needed to be replaced. This past Friday, I dropped the mast and replaced the bulbs and unfortunately that was not the issue. After a little checking, it appears as the the fiberglass resin or something has eaten through the coating of the wires where they go through the top deck (right at the plug). The wires are basically gone. I hooked a battery to the wires where they head up the mast and all of the mast wiring seems to be good as I could get the lights to burn there. So now I am looking to install a new plug at the base of the mast and running a new wire into the top deck and back to the main switch.

Anyone have any experience with this? It looks like the dimple where the plug rests on top of the boat falls in the bulkhead down below. I thought there may be some kind of chase in the bulk head, but after further checking it seems as though the wire below runs in a chase within the fiberglass and not in the bulkhead. Am I better off patching the dimple on top and drilling a new hole and installing a new plug and running the wire tight to the bulkhead below? I don't think there is anyway to repull the new wire through the fiberglass chase. Maybe I can drill a new hole at the dimple on top and angle it so that shoots our just behind the bulk head below but I am not sure. Anyone have any experience with this and can help? Thanks for any help you can provide.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2011 : 07:34:23

move to a new spot.

Wires in a Catalina are often glassed in so if you run new lines don't waste your time trying to follow the original run, make a new run.

Edited by - pastmember on 02/21/2011 07:35:27

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3440 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2011 : 08:01:11

There are a number of us that have had experience with the cabin wiring to deck/mast connector. You could do a search on this issue and find many posts on the subject. One issue is that the cabin/mast wire going from the cabin into the deck connector have oxides that have deteriorated the connection. If there is enough slack, you could try and pull up the wire a bit and cut new leads to the connectore or clean off the wire leads and see if you have any juice flowing thru it. Some have found that the wire is encapsulated in the fiberglas and either could not pull up any slack in it or that the cabin wires needed to be replaced. It also may run down the mast column in the main cabin and is just a snug fit up near the deck connector. If it is in the mast column, you probably can determine that by opening the bilge cover and feel the port underside of the fiberglas adjacent to the bilge cover access. If there are wires there, then trace them and they probably go up the mast column to the vicinity of the deck connector. A tug on it and it will come down the column. The thing is that the deck connector area may be too snug or snaking another cable to thru it just too hard and so you are then left with replacing the wire and thru another path.

Your idea drilling a new hole at an angle is the way to go if you have to replace your wiring. I bought from Home Depot one of those extra long drill shanks and angled the drilling thru the deck connector hole forward with hopes to get the hole to come out forward of the main cabin bulkhead and into the Head compartment area. From that hole, the cable can be routed down along the side behind the head, then into the main cabin along the hull port side to the switch panel. I angled the drill bit as sharp an angle as I could to get it to come out forward of the bulkhead. Then I went into the cabin/head area to see where the hole came out and could not find the hole ! I redrilled and pushed thru as far as the bit would go and still it seemed I did not drill thru forward of the bulkhead. It did not seem possible - It felt like it had gone thru and the long shank bit seemed very long to accomlish this task...So I took another look in the Head area. Then I spotted it - The hole was hidden because the hole came out directly thru the rubber molding at the bulkhead to deck joint - The rubber molding had gone right back into place after the bit was removed and so it was hard to spot the hole. Anyway - The hole dfrilling is all set up time and is a very easy to do task. There is no downside since you are using access thru the deck connector hole which already exists.

When I finished the wiring and pulling out the old wire that was in the mast column, I combined this job with installing a second swithc panel and fans. My website has photos of that effort but not on the mast wiring.

Edited by - OLarryR on 02/21/2011 08:09:36

whitlecj
Deckhand

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11 Posts

Response Posted - 02/21/2011 : 08:05:56

Thanks for the all the help guys. Looks like a common problem and you have given me the info I need to take care of it. Thanks so much.

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JoshMcCullock
1st Mate

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USA
68 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2011 : 21:22:08

I'm planning to fully rewire the mast in a couple weeks and I'm going to start with an all new run from the panel. Our deck light has never worked so I'm excited to be able to use that this season!
While I was surfing CD for the wiring I needed, I noticed their LED cabin lamp replacements. Anyone have any experience with those?

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3440 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2011 : 05:08:48

I bought LED replacement bulbs for my cabin lights and I think I bought them from CD but not 100% sure and besides, this was a few years ago. In general, LEDs used to replace cabin lights are not sold in a way that you can compare one mfr's product to another unless you kind of get a feel for their satisfaction by others but most have only wehat they bought and so...that's not comparing one against another. In general, the LEDs will produce a different type of light...usually less bright than the festoons I used to use but okay...not great. In proportion to the amp load, the LEDs produce a good bit of light at a fraction of the amp load of the original cabin lights and so overall, I am happy with them. But I may experiment with other LEDs.

As far as brightness and how wide the beam is spread is very hard to compare one to another. They are not as good to read a book by as compared to the original cabin lights. The configuration of LEDs is also very confusing and misleading. You can buy an LED replacement that has a cluster of little LEDs and that can produce less light than another LED bulb that has fewer LEDs on it. One LED light I would like to experiment with is called the Sensi-bulb. I have seen it advertized on the web and I saw it at the Annapolis Sailboat show a couple of years ago. This LED is just one LED but it's brightness far surpasses the brightness from a number of the LED bulbs being sold that are made up with a cluster of LEDs in it. So..go figure on how to compare.

Edited by - on

JoshMcCullock
1st Mate

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USA
68 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2011 : 07:11:45

Thats interesting Larry. I don't so much worry about the amps they draw since I'm just sailing on a lake and never really far from power. Some of our covers are cracked and brittle and I'd rather just replace the entire light than spend money on the replacement cover.
It's still pretty far down the list though :)

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3440 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2011 : 11:37:26

Most that replace their original cabin bulbs with LEDs do it to save on amp load. This is especially the case for those that do not have or choose not to pay for shore power (If shore power is automatically included with your dock fee, then no issue with an amp load). Amp load also a concern for those doing extended overnighters. Given that you do not have these concerns, except for the much longer life that LEDs have (and this would be an addl reason why some go to LEDs for anchor lights/nav lights), there is no reason to replace cabin lights with an LED replacement. In most instances, an LED light will provide somewhat inferior light compared to the festoons. LEDs are improving in what is being offered and so perhaps there are some out there that will provide equivalent light to the festoons but in almost all cases, the LED bulb and/or LED fixtures will be much more expensive than equivalent incandescent bulbs and/or fixtures. In the case of anchor or nav lights, the cost of an LED fixture can be anywhere between two to ..6 times or more expensive compared to an incandescent equivalent. LED bulb replacements are perhaps 2 to 3 or 4 times more expensive than an incandescent bulb. A cabin festoon light, if it blows out, no big deal. You have other cabin lighrs and some of our boats have 2 festoons in each fixture, so you may be able to still get the one bulb light out of it. If you have replacements onboard, easy enough to change out when in the cabin. But for a nav light or an anchor light, if the festoon needs to be replaced, it is doubtful one would do it while sailing and so LED longer service life can be by itself a justifiable reason to go with LEDs.

Anyway, maybe there are addl reasons in comparing pro/con of switching to LEDs in the cabin but my thought is if amp load is not an issue, then no real reason to go with LED cabin lights.

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2011 : 11:47:02

The LED assembles and individual bulbs that I bought at WM are significantly brighter than my original cabin lighting, but I did have to reverse the leads in the 2 original housings that I kept. It would be nice if the manufacturers would all give the output in lumens and the color temperature, but that would still leave the coverage pattern up in the air. I can attest that while these are a little hotter temp (more blue) or perceptually cooler, they are bright and have a very even distribution pattern without hotspots: Model 8975138 http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=11151&partNumber=8975153&langId=-1

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