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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Beginer Question Re: Topping Lift Line

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srf2
1st Mate

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Initially Posted - 07/21/2009 : 06:54:51

This is my first full summer with my new 250 hull #958. Here is my question. If I loosen my topping line too much before hoisting my main sail, my boom hits my pedestal guard or drops below it. If I pull the sail up without loosening my topping line, the sail hits the topping line blocking me from pulling it up all the way. What is the correct procedure and what am I doing wrong? When should the topping line be released or loosened - before, after or during pulling up the sail? Any help wuld be greatly appreciated. Thank you all.

Steven F.

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John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 07:23:03

I don't release the topping lift until after the sail is up.

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windsong
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Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 08:08:24

I lower the topping lift to just above the pedestal guard, then haul up the mainsail. That gives you just about the right amount of slack in the topping lift. If you want, take a Sharpie and put a mark at the point to which it should be lowered.
If you're not using your spinnaker halyard, you can rig the topping lift back to the cockpit using the block and line clutch on your port side that are standard with the boat. Then just tie off the spinnaker halyard to a mast cleat.

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srf2
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Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 11:08:21

Thanks for the very helpful responses. I'm going to mark or perhaps even knot the toping lift at just the right height. Even if I do this though, won't the topping lift still be tight if the sail is not up? Also, I guess I should only raise the main sail when the boat is directly into the wind so that it goes straight up in line with the boom at the center and does not hit the topping lift. Thanks again John & Michael.

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windsong
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Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 12:09:03

When you raise the sail, it will lift the boom (you want the sail to lift the boom), and the topping lift will go slack.
On another point, it is helpful for the forum if you create a signature that contains the basic info about your boat. Just click "Profile," log in, and then create the signature. It will populate automatically every time you post.
Welcome! Your hull number is not far from mine!

Edited by - windsong on 07/21/2009 12:09:57

John Russell
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Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 12:43:30

Don't overthink it. It's just a topping lift, meant to keep the boom off your head when the sail is down.

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PCP777
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Response Posted - 07/21/2009 : 12:58:59

I always leave it on until I raise the sail, than I let it go, then adjust it to slightly slack after the sail is raised. Then the sail holds the boom and I get the best sail shape.

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britinusa
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Response Posted - 07/22/2009 : 04:37:40

I'm curious about your topping lift setup.
It should not be configured such that the topping lift taking the weight of the boom should be any hindrence to the raising of the sail.

Could you photograph of sketch or describe the setup.

Here's a description of mine (2005 model WB)

Topping lift line connected to masthead, reaches down to about 18" from the end of the boom when sail is fully hoisted.
There is a spring hook on the end of the topping lift.

The topping lift adjustment is via a line that enters the stbd side of the boom just aft of the vang connection and is held secure with a jamb cleat.
That line passes into the boom going fwd to an internal block, then aft out of the end of the book passing a built in block on the end of the boom (Outhaul also passes out aft end of the boom)
The line has a thimble on the end which is attached to the topping lift line spring hook.

I don't like the setup, involves climbing on cabing top to make adjustments. So have plans in the works to modify it.

Paul

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Arlyn Stewart
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Response Posted - 07/22/2009 : 07:38:14

Topping lifts are configured in two ways... fixed and adjustable though a fixed is mostly used on boats that don't have mains'l reef points. An adjustable should have one of the properties of a fixed however in that its longer length should be a fixed length to limit the boom drop.

This requires a carefully planned stopper knot in the adjustable line to limit the extended length for just a little slack when the mainsheet is hardened fully. While marking the line at this point might work, better is a stopper knot so that the topping line doesn't have to be cleated when released... it is simply limited by the stopper knot.

Adjustable lifts are preferred when reefing will be done because it allows the boom to be parked high enough to ease reefing so that when hauling reefing lines, one doesn't have to haul the boom weight with the reefing line often popping sail slugs especially if the reef is a single line jiffy reef.

As to whether the topping lift line should be raised when raising the main... it could be to save a bit of weight at the final point of hoisting the main, but I don't do it. The only time I adjust the topping line is while reefing... otherwise the topping line is limited by the stopper knot and acts like a fixed topping lift.

Paul raises a good discussion point about sail management. Ideally all management should be done at the same location. If one leads lines to cockpit... don't leave the topping lift forward on the side of the boom and have reefing lines led to cockpit. If there are no clutches available, a better route would be a cleat near the end of the boom that can be reached from the cockpit.

All of my sail controls are at a standing position starboard side of the boom right near the mast. Decide where you want to do sail control and then do it all from that location.

btw, Sail management can safely be done from the coach roof and in some ways I think safer because there will always be the occasional fouled line requiring going forward... if there is fear or no proficiency in doing so or no proper rigging to do so, then I'd be concerned. It does require intentional effort to ensure safety however and tether and jacklines are a must though don't be lulled into thinking that a tether and jack lines are all that is needed. Such do not keep one on the coach roof but only with the boat and perhaps over the side and unable to get back aboard.

My approach is to rig a short 3' tether with snap clip at the mast. Using normal 6'tether and jack line, I go to mast and then add the short tether to the safety harness ring. That short tether gives just the right length to hand the halyard, topping lift, and reefing lines but prevent me from leaving the coach roof.

Finally, just to show the pre-thought given to safety, on my safety harness is a folded and stored fifteen foot extension tether that should I end up over the side, the extension can be added to the six foot and then the six foot can be released allowing reaching the swim ladder. I should point out... my boat is set up for Great Lakes sailing, which includes long crossings requiring night sailing. The crew is sometimes asleep while a watch is for all practical purposes single handing.

Edited by - Arlyn Stewart on 07/22/2009 07:40:26

JohnP
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Response Posted - 07/22/2009 : 10:08:53

Very clever, Arlyn! That should work great. And there's always something else to do to fix up the boat!

But I'm wondering if you ever tested your 2-tether system with a volunteer in the drink? Can you add and release snap shackles while hanging in your harness just above the waterline?

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Arlyn Stewart
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Response Posted - 07/22/2009 : 13:50:11

John.... I doubt the snap shackle could be released under full body load. With jack lines running just inside the stanchions, a six foot tether should have my weight born mostly by the water.

The problem would be if the boat is moving well and loads the shackle heavily though there are still a couple of options.
<ol type="1"><li>The snap shackle lanyard is multi looped so as to get a good grip.</li><li>It is long enough to clench in teeth to leave arms free to pull on tether and yank release with a head snap.</li><li>The emergency tether has a caribiner to make to the web eye on the regular tether, it could be tossed over the life line or around a stanchion and cleated back on the webbing, then a knife could be used to cut loose of the six foot tether.</li></ol id="1">
It's not a fool proof scheme. If the boat were moving well, the shock when the fifteen foot tether comes up taught might be a killer. One still has to get to the swim ladder to board. If I were being dragged and had life jacket and were within swimming distance of land, I'd not choose to come up hard on the long tether preferring rather to cut loose. At issue for me however when sailing the Great Lakes is exposure factor. One needs to get back aboard pretty fast.

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