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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

3 Position Switch On/Off/On for Bilge Pump

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Bortiquai
1st Mate

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88 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/31/2008 : 20:24:46

I have a rule mate automatic bilge pump. It's the model with the auto-switch built in. So it has three leads coming out - one for auto, one for manual on and one for negative.

I got a 3 Position switch, so that I can have it Always on (Automatic), Off, or Manual On.

I can't seem to figure out how to wire this. Any suggestions?

Thanks

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Tom Potter
Master Marine Consultant

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1913 Posts

Response Posted - 12/31/2008 : 20:51:26

Check [url="http://www.sailingsite.org/library/pumps/jabsco_rm1100-24_rule_mate_instructions_24.pdf"]this out[/url] it may help.

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britinusa
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Response Posted - 12/31/2008 : 20:56:40

Paul

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Bortiquai
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Response Posted - 01/01/2009 : 09:29:28

First off, thank you for your replies.

I think I should have been more specific in my post.

I got a Cole Hersee 3-position rocker switch that is DPDT.

On the back, there are 7 blades. I haven't been able to figure out the configuration with this thing, and the instructions are a little vague to me.

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Dave Bristle
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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2009 : 13:50:36

I can't see the configuration of the terminals, but a DPDT (double-pole double-throw) switch has two inputs (positive) and four outputs--two for each input. The rocker in essence is controlling two independent two-way switches. Your seventh terminal is probably for a ground connection--I think you can ignore that in a DC application. That's more stuff than you need--I think a SPDT is more appropriate--one switch directing current to either of two outputs, with center off. Then Paul's diagram applies--input from fuse, outputs to float switch and pump. See [url="http://www.kpsec.freeuk.com/components/switch.htm"]this[/url].

With your DPDT, you could use one input and its two outputs and ignore the rest...

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 01/01/2009 15:43:55

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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Response Posted - 01/01/2009 : 21:32:53

I concur with Dave, a SPDT switch is what you want, or use half of your DPDT. Rule makes a switch specific for this application, that's what I used for my bilge pump.

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redeye
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Response Posted - 01/02/2009 : 07:32:34

I connect the lines on the pump to a battery first and then label the lines with white gaffers tape.

On your pump you have three leads. Ground, always on positive, and auto pump positive.

check the paperwork to find the brown line with the white line to see if it is the always on line.

wire the grnd to your grounding buss bar.

Wire each positive to one side of the the top and bottom pairs of the switch.

Run a line to the grounding buss bar from the other side of the pairs of the top and bottom of the switch.

it is OK to gang the grounds.

Then I label the switch. on off auto

hope this helps

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Dave Bristle
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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/02/2009 : 10:30:42

I don't know about anybody else, but I'm confused...

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redeye
 
1. wire the grnd to your grounding buss bar.

2. Wire each positive to one side of the the top and bottom pairs of the switch.

3. Run a line to the grounding buss bar from the other side of the pairs of the top and bottom of the switch.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
#3 doesn't make sense to me. It seems to me there's a single positive input to that switch, with two positives out to the ON and AUTO terminals on the pump. The negative should be from the pump to the bus (as in #1).

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redeye
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Response Posted - 01/03/2009 : 08:37:46

My Mistake.... I am sorry to post when I WAS WRONG please forgive the bad advice and thank you Dave for pointing it out. I'd bet you have already figured it out but:

Power should go from the Fused Positive panel, through the switch, to the pump, then to ground.

Wire the pump negative (ground) to the grounding bus bar.

You can use a continuity "Beep" on a testing meter to figure out which terminals are connected on the switch. The meter beeps when the circuit is closed or when the switch has connected two of the terminals you are testing.

The circuits may be connecting, when switched, left and right.

Jumpers ( terminals that would stay connected regardless of the switch position ) may be connecting up and down.

The manufacturer can wire the switches all kinds of different ways, regardless of what they call the switch. YOU HAFTA FIGURE OUT WHAT THEY DID!

They may jump the circuits together, or have terminals available for you to jumper power together.

If the switch is up then two of the terminals left and right on the back of the switch are usually connected, or the manufact has jumped two of the circuits together and then 3 (or more) of the terminals may be connected.

You could have all of the terminals on one side jumped together.

Dave is correct in that you probably have the odd terminal out as a ground, and you can or cannot use the ground.

If it is a ground ( negative ) it would not connect to any terminal regardless of switch position. You should not get continuity from it to any terminal.

The odd terminal could also be a positive in going to one or both of the circuits top and bottom. If so then you would have continuity from the odd terminal to two or more of the terminals.

YOU COULD ( and probably )HAVE:

4 terminals top that when switched up are connecting 2 terminals left to right, two pairs, AND two of these on one side are jumped together.

2 terminals bottom that are connected when the switch is down, left and right.

1 ground. ( probably to keep a switch light on )

IF SO WIRE:

Fused Power in ( red wire ) to the top left terminal.
Jumped power ( add a red wire ) from the terminal just below the top left terminal and jump it to the bottom left terminal.

If they ( the top left and the one below it ) are not jumped, then you jump from the top left terminal ( two lines on one terminal )

Brown Wire from the bilge pump to the top right terminal.

Brown wire with white line from the bilge pump to the bottom right terminal.

I hope this helps.

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Bortiquai
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Response Posted - 01/05/2009 : 12:36:15

Thanks to everyone who replied. This seemed a little more confusing than I think it should have been. Mostly because the mfg instructeions were not very helpful at all. Not only that, it said there should be pins labeled 1-7, and on the device, there were two number 3's and no number 1 and no number 7.

Anyway, after reading your post, I went back and did some more experiments. This is what I came up with:

Pump Positive Manual (Brown w/White) to Switch - Top right side.
Pump Positive Auto (Brown) to Switch - Bottom right side.

Positive from DC System to Switch - Middle right side.

Pump Negative (Black) twisted with lead from DC Negative system bus bar. Both connected to Switch Ground.

The Three blades on the left side of the switch are not connected

So now, when the switch is in the middle position, the pump is off, and the switch indicator lights are off.

When the switch is in the up position, (Auto), the top light is on. If there is water in the bilge, the pump turns on, and the top AND bottom indicator lights turn on.

When the switch is in the bottom position, (Manual), the pump turns on, and the bottom light turns on (top light is off).

I was surprised to see that both switch indicator lights turn on when the pump clicks on in auto mode. But I acutally like this, because it is a good visual to tell me the pump is pumping, in case I can't hear it.

Anyway, even though your original post wasn't exactly right, it did get me on the right path.

Seems like they could do a better job of explaining the pin outs in the instructions. I guess they think you are supposed to already know this stuff.

For others who are in the same predicament, this is a Cole Hersee Contura Rocker Switch, DPDT On/Off/On MFG#: 58332-26-BP

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Dave Bristle
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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/05/2009 : 16:59:38

Home run! When you think about where the connections go inside the pump, the lights make sense (both when running on Auto, just one when running on Manual). I agree--that's perfect.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 01/05/2009 17:02:14

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 01/06/2009 : 07:22:58

You figured it out...Cool...
Sorry I missed it, I thought about posting it that way but I figured it might not be that simple and you'd get even more frustrated.

Remembering how to think about it is the hardest part, and I hope my discustion helped.

I find it funny that the panel designs kinda went from:

a bank of switches running up and down that switch left and right
To:
a bank of rockers running left and right that switch up and down.

A relatively simple layout. Power comes in in the middle and the switch connects up and down.

WHY they can't try a simple explanation in English in the paperwork is beyond me.

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