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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 250 Specific Forum

winter in the water

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zebra50
Captain

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USA
408 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/11/2008 : 19:05:53

I may have to leave Papas Boat in the water over the Missouri winter. Every time I get ready to pull it out, the weather wont cooperate. Being a WB, anyone see a problem with leaving it in?? I have put some anti freeze (west marine pink stuff) in through the vent tube, about 2 gals. I thought about putting a small safe space heater in the cabin over the winter which should keep the battery etc warm. The fresh water tank has been emptied and pink stuff put in to protect the lines and valves.

Jay
Papa's Boat II
250WB #370
Blog:http://zebra50-boilingpoint.blogspot.com

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John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 12/11/2008 : 19:49:12

If the water surrounding the boat freezes, you'll have problems. The pressure of the freezing water can damage the hull. If you can drop some [url="http://www.thepondreport.com/dock-bubbler-deicer.shtml"]water circulators [/url] around the boat to keep it from freezing, If the surrounding water doesn't freeze, anti-freeze in the tanks of the boat should protect the systems. Be sure to pump some of the antifreeze through the freshwater system to protect those lines.

Even if the weather is terrible, I'd think it easier to pull the boat than to keep it from freezing.

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glivs
Admiral

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USA
831 Posts

Response Posted - 12/11/2008 : 20:38:27

For some things in life, risk only what you are willing to loose. I do not know what kind of ice build up or what spring break-up is like where your boat is, but if either could pose a risk to your boat, haul it. Cold and wet can be miserable and pose a significant safety threat so plan accordingly. As for the battery, as long as it is fully charged, it would take some incredibly low temps to freeze it. If discharged, however, it is vulnerable.

That said, there is a fellow here in Mallett's Bay (VT) that has overwintered on his 30' ketch for several years now. Late winter ice thickness is typically 24+" but he keeps a couple of bubblers on near his hull and cabin temperatures about 55-60F (13-16C)when on board. Big article in the local rag about him last year but I cannot locate it in their archives to capture a pic to post.

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glen
Captain

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359 Posts

Response Posted - 12/12/2008 : 15:35:59

John and Gerry are right, pulling her out is the best option. I think if someone started a thread on the nastiest pull outs, just about every one could submit a memory or two

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Sailinggrace
Deckhand

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USA
19 Posts

Response Posted - 12/15/2008 : 17:51:39

Hi there. I actually got very concerned about my boat up in Clarkston Washington on the river about the freezing problem yesterday as our temps up here are getting down to the low teens and below freezing. I have let the water out of my ballast and she is still in the water. I will also have a light inside the cabin to help keep her a bit warmer on the inside. The river does not normally freeze, if it does, it is just some ice on the top of the water, so I am hoping that all will be good. As far as sailing her, I'll have to put the water back in and just keep an eye on the river as to its possible freezing on the surface.
Other that what has already been said about the pump, any other thoughts on leaving a 250 in the water for the winter???

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John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 12/15/2008 : 20:03:51

You need to put antifreeze in the potable water system. If that freezes in the lines, they will likely burst. I'd throw some in the ballast tank as well even though you emptied it.

Oh, yeah, pray the river doesn't freeze enough to damage the hull and that you won't have to deal with ice floes in the spring.

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dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2008 : 09:18:28

Being a C-25 owner, I'm curious. How do you get water out of the ballast tank without hauling the boat? Is there a built-in air pump, or do you blow air in through the vent hole with something like a shop vac in blower mode?

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bear
Admiral

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USA
909 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2008 : 09:34:58

David, There is drain valve in the bottom of the ballast tank which can be opened either in the water or on land from the bilge. If you choose the in water method there is a vent in the front of the anchor locker. A small air pump with LOW pressure injecting air into the vent will then force the water out the bottom of the boat, drain valve must be opened first. When you see air bubbles coming up around the boat the tank is virtually empty.

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Sailinggrace
Deckhand

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USA
19 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2008 : 19:31:46

Thanks for the tip, I actually pulled my boat out of the water just enough to drain the ballast. It was about 1 degree and getting dark and we did not want to spend too much time on the water with those conditions.

How long does it take to drain the water while the boat is in the water, with the air pressure? I might do that next time, although it was a pretty simple task to pull her for a few minutes.

Mary

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bear
Admiral

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USA
909 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2008 : 20:21:53

David, It takes about 10 minutes for me, you really didn't get all the water out by just pulling the boat and letting it drain, I would really consider some user friendly anti-freeze just to be safe. Air pressure is the real key to blowing the ballast too much is detrimental to the tank structure. Some members speak of a small battery air pump from Walmart's.....

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zebra50
Captain

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USA
408 Posts

Response Posted - 12/18/2008 : 14:43:42

It takes me about 10 min also. I use a shop vac with a small tip that fits in the vent tube of the anchor locker. It makes it easier to haul out on the trailer without the water ballast. After that, in the past, I leave it on the trailer with the drain valve open. I thiknk that I will empty the ballast but leave it in the water, atleast until the weather gets a bit better to haul it out. I do have some work projects for spring that would require it to be out of the water.

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jlannutti
Navigator

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USA
102 Posts

Response Posted - 12/19/2008 : 07:44:47

Bear,
Just how much pressure are you talking about to "blow the ballast" so to speak. I'd never leave the boat in the water over the winter but I'd like to have the option to drain that tank while she's in the slip. I have a 12v pump that will get my car tires up to 30-35psi...is that gentle enough to not risk damaging the seams of my ballast tank?
Joe

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britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 12/19/2008 : 09:08:14

I would think 30-35lbs is toooo heavy.

The battery on our rechargble coleman air pump from walmart died after 3 years of use blowing ballast.

Just got a new unit but not the rechargeable version (couldn't recharge it on the boat anyway!)
The new unit runs off the 12v outlet in the cabin. I removed the original cable from the unit and replaced it with some 12v landscape lighting wire (handles bigger amps = less voltage loss). So now my air pump can be plugged into the cabin outlet and reaches easily (25') to the bow vent.

Paul

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jlannutti
Navigator

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USA
102 Posts

Response Posted - 12/19/2008 : 16:40:19

My pump doesn't deliver 30 lbs all at once...it slowly gets the tire pressure up that high. With the ballast tank drain opened the pressure would never get anywhere near that high. Anyone out there who has used this method please check your pump and see what it's rated at. Thank you,
Joe

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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 12/20/2008 : 11:04:19

I don't see how you can threaten the tank as long as the valve is open... The air will reach a pressure sufficient to push the water out and no more, regardless of what the pump is capable of.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 12/20/2008 11:04:44

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 12/20/2008 : 14:54:19

Dave, I agree with you up to the point where there is a max flow of water out the drain valve. Not sure if the pump in question would ever get there. But tire pumps tend to go for pressure rather than volume, and we need volume rather than pressure. I know how long it takes to pump up a flat tire and that has a lower volume but much higher pressure.

I could be talking garbage. Biased by what we use that works.

Paul

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bill bosworth
Navigator

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USA
172 Posts

Response Posted - 12/20/2008 : 21:04:33

David;
I have been blowing the balast out of my boat using a bellows style foot pumb, designed to blow up a rubber raft. The hose that came with it fits into the vent hole (with the help of a couple of wraps of electrical tape). I find that it takes about 7 or 8 minutes to remove the ballast. I like using the foot pumb, no batteries or cords to worry about.

Bill C250wb #134 Serendipity
ON Beautiful Kerr lake N.C.

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britinusa
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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 12/21/2008 : 03:44:58

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by bill bosworth
 David;
I find that it takes about 7 or 8 minutes to remove the ballast. Bill C250wb #134 Serendipity
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Wow! that's cool! I thought it would take longer, we have to stuff the air pump into the vent for at least 10mins

Peggy pumps out the ballast while I fetch the trailer.

Ah there's the problem! The pump would stop after about 30 seconds!

Paul

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