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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 250 Specific Forum

Yamaha 9.9 vs Honda 9.9 motor replacement

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Albanker
1st Mate

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USA
40 Posts

Initially Posted - 07/15/2021 : 19:01:20

Considering both of the above as replacement for my 2001Honda 15HP engine. Both are rated well, but the Yamaha has a few advantages like a flush port near the front of the engine, parts availability, and supposedly a little quieter. They used to be a heavy motor but current models are similar to Honda. On the other hand, I have been satisfied with Honda. It is somewhat of a pain to flush in the water. From what everybody has said on this forum, I think 9.9 is plenty of power. They both look to fit fine. Very interested in any opinions�Thanks

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4012 Posts

Response Posted - 07/16/2021 : 10:43:52

I wouldn't say one brand is better than another because today's outboards are all well made and dependable. Base your decision on what works best for you like features,parts and service in your area, price etc. A 9.9 is plenty of power and so would be an 8. If your on a lake and don't travel great distances a 6hp would do. I have 2 C25s in my marina that have 6hp Sailpros and they seem to manage on Long Island sound.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9047 Posts

Response Posted - 07/16/2021 : 11:32:43

I'm not sure about the Yamahas these days, but the Honda 8 is the very same engine as the 9.9 except (according to a company rep) the cam, which is set for more low-end torque in the 8 and, and for more high-end HP in the 9.9. The 8 has a slightly lower peak rev range, which also probably affects the HP rating. He recommended the high-thrust 8 for my C-25, and a 9.9 for a planing dinghy or skiff--even though the 8 is a few hundred bucks less.

I don't think I ever ran my Honda 8 to max revs or even twisted the throttle to wide-open--it had plenty of thrust for all conditions and situations I encountered. As Scott suggests, I considered local dealer support in my choice. But also, at that time, the Yamaha High Thrust 8 didn't have a pull-starter except by removing the cowl and the flywheel cover, and using a supplied piece of rope. That was 20 years ago...

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Albanker
1st Mate

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USA
40 Posts

Response Posted - 07/16/2021 : 15:05:29

Thanks for the replies. Honda dealer said I can flush with engine tilted using their flush attachment so I guess that helps. Also found the Yamaha was about $600 more for an engine comparable to the Honda. As to an 8 vs 9.9 , my concern is that in Punta Gorda Florida , I have about 30 minutes to get to the harbor and thought the 9.9 might run at a lower rpm for the same speed and be quieter??? Am I wrong

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5320 Posts

Response Posted - 07/17/2021 : 07:02:14

In my case with a C25 and an 8HP Honda I can attain hull speed (~5.5kt) at 3/4 throttle. Engine purrs like a kitten.
At 1/2 throttle I can do 5.2kts and save a lot of gas (vs 0.3kt)

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain � Milford, CT

Edited by - Voyager on 07/17/2021 07:03:55

Tradewind
Admiral

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USA
531 Posts

Response Posted - 07/17/2021 : 13:14:02

I recently replaced my Honda 8 with a new Honda 9.9, to me there isn't any noticeable difference in performance or sound at the low rpms I use to maintain around 5.2 knots. Only reason I switched to 9.9 is because I couldn't find an 8hp anywhere.

1998 250WK #331
CILCIA
Steve
Pensacola, FL

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9047 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2021 : 20:32:33

Really, the difference is the revs to get on plane (not likely with a C-25) and maybe $200. The torque to maneuver around a dock is in Honda 8's favor. Those are very fine points--it's the same engine. The Honda rep told me the high thrust 8 was my better choice.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 07/20/2021 20:36:33

DelilahII
Deckhand

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USA
7 Posts

Response Posted - 07/26/2021 : 16:51:10

Just my two cents trying to help: Everyone has opinions on outboard brands, but the Tohatsu 9.9 is EFI, and if battery charging is of interest to you, produces up to 12 amps charging. The 9.9 EFI 25" shaft fits well on my 2009 250 Keel.

I use the same EFI Tohatsu motor (20 HP version) on a small power boat, and the EFI is a game-changer in both ease of starting and fuel economy.

I've owned the Yamaha and Honda too and they are also great motors of course.

Catalina 250K MK II

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9047 Posts

Response Posted - 07/26/2021 : 19:57:01

I can�t argue against the new Tohatsu 9.9�EFI is very attractive, and 4-stroke carb jets (Yamaha and Honda) can be problematic. Tohatsu prices have always been attractive, as was weight�I think the new 9.9 is more on parity. Compare to the Honda 8, their recommendation. Mercurys are Tohatsus�they might have the EFI model now.
It could come down to local support�I�m a fan of buying from someone who will provide it. YMMV.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

DelilahII
Deckhand

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USA
7 Posts

Response Posted - 07/26/2021 : 21:55:07

The 9.9 Merc ProKicker for 2021 has an EFI option or a carb'ed option. I don't think they were EFI in 2020. #8203;

The EFI Tohatsu 9.9 seems heavier than Yamaha to begin with. The Tohatsu 9.9 in the 25" shaft is electric/manual start at 112 lbs; the lightest manual start Yamaha configuration is 101 lbs. The Yamaha in electric/manual start in the same configuration as the Tohatsu is 106 lbs. The Honda seems to be heaviest from the published weights.

Suzuki also has a 9.9 EFI, and I have some experience with that motor as well; it's also really great. It seems to only be available in a power tilt and trim version in a 25" shaft, which makes it quite a bit heavier at 128 lbs.

Personally, I was coming from an outboard that weighed more than 112 lbs. The extra charging ability of the Tohatsu meant I felt comfortable downsizing my battery bank, which dropped about 50lbs.

I think the number of dealers depends on where you are; in the Pacific Northwest, it seems like it's easy to find Tohatsu dealers, but maybe we're in a bubble.

On size: I would have made due with a high-thrust 6, but past experience with similar sized boats pushed me to stick with 9.9. If I had time to wait for the best wind and tides all the time, I would definitely use a 6. Obviously, saving a couple bucks with the 8 is the way to go if you are sticking with Yamaha or Honda.

Not trying to sell anyone on Tohatsu - Just put a lot of time and miles on my Tohatsu EFI 20hp (same platform) over the last two years, and I am really impressed with every aspect of it.

Catalina 250K MK II

Edited by - DelilahII on 07/27/2021 08:29:49

davidtree
Deckhand

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USA
18 Posts

Response Posted - 07/27/2021 : 13:56:24

I replaced my Honda 8 HP with the Tohatsu 9.9 HP with a 4 blade prop, i am happy with it's performance.

BUT!!!! it is larger in the transom, and not able to turn it any to starboard to move the boat to starboard, caution on it fitting snug.
DAvid

DelilahII
Deckhand

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USA
7 Posts

Response Posted - 07/27/2021 : 14:31:48

quote:
Originally posted by davidtree

I replaced my Honda 8 HP with the Tohatsu 9.9 HP with a 4 blade prop, i am happy with it's performance.

BUT!!!! it is larger in the transom, and not able to turn it any to starboard to move the boat to starboard, caution on it fitting snug.
DAvid

Good point that I should have mentioned! I had the same problem with the Yamaha 9.9 too.

My last boat had the outboard fixed in a well, so it has been a while since I thought about steering with the outboard. :)

Catalina 250K MK II

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 07/28/2021 : 06:46:41

I was also going to mention the issue of size on the transom. Motors with small, narrow cowls are an advantage for that. Some people don't want to rotate the motor. Some of you may remember that I set up a hard link that rotated the motor with my rudder (search the archives), so motor size was very important to me. My boat came with a 2000-era Honda 15 HP (identical twin of the 9.9 HP of that era) that had the older squared-off cowl, and it just barely cleared by a few mm on each side. I had to be careful to place it properly each season, because getting it just a little off the spot would cause it to hit the fiberglass on one side or the other. The newer (current) Hondas have rounded cowls that look like they're larger (though I never tried them so I'm not sure).

If rotation of the motor is important to you, I would encourage you to trailer the boat (if you have a trailer) to the outboard dealer and make your purchase contingent on a successful test of this. You don't need to run the motor - just stick it on the transom and see if it rotates. Obviously you can't do this if you buy online, so this is one of many reasons to support a local brick-and-mortar dealer for this purchase.

Rick S., Swarthmore, PA
PO of Take Five, 1998 Catalina 250WK #348 (relocated to Baltimore's Inner Harbor)
New owner of 2001 Catalina 34MkII #1535 Breakin' Away (at Rock Hall Landing Marina)

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9047 Posts

Response Posted - 07/28/2021 : 08:45:38

quote:
Originally posted by TakeFive

...Obviously you can't do this if you buy online, so this is one of many reasons to support a local brick-and-mortar dealer for this purchase.

I'll pontificate further: Buying something on-line after selecting it in a brick-and-mortar setting is.....

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 07/28/2021 : 10:39:34

quote:
Originally posted by Stinkpotter

quote:
Originally posted by TakeFive

...Obviously you can't do this if you buy online, so this is one of many reasons to support a local brick-and-mortar dealer for this purchase.
I'll pontificate further: Buying something on-line after selecting it in a brick-and-mortar setting is.....

...theft of services.

Rick S., Swarthmore, PA
PO of Take Five, 1998 Catalina 250WK #348 (relocated to Baltimore's Inner Harbor)
New owner of 2001 Catalina 34MkII #1535 Breakin' Away (at Rock Hall Landing Marina)

Albanker
1st Mate

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USA
40 Posts

Response Posted - 07/28/2021 : 11:23:08

Unfortunately I don�t have a trailer and dealer won�t come to me,so I have to rely on installers to measure and be sure non tiller Yamaha 9.9 will fit and turn fine� From owners manual measurements ,it appears no problem. I will run throttle and gear shirt to pedestal and have installer install switches for ignition choke and tilt. Should mention I am in Illinois and boat in Florida.

wm36
1st Mate

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USA
69 Posts

Response Posted - 08/03/2021 : 19:41:23

This raises a question I've had. This is our 4th year with our WB. To the best knowledge of the previous owner, our Honda 8HP is probably a 1996. It feels tight, sounds great, did a major service at a Honda dealer last year and, other than a motor mount that needed replacing, all was well. When should I consider replacing the motor? I'm not looking for excuses to spend money, but I sail on the Columbia River and a motor failure would not be pleasant.

Wayne & Lynn
Hillsboro OR
1995 C250 WB #151

k3fuller
1st Mate

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USA
82 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2021 : 12:12:33

I have thought about that with my 2008 Nissan 8HP. And for me the answer is: Until I lose confidence in the motor. I have replaced and up-carb'd the motor with the 9.9 carb. It's had new plugs every couple years. Both oil and gear fluids changed regularly and generally runs like a top. Always starts on the 2nd pull but often the 1st. Has enough torque to drive the boat efficiently in all conditions I have encountered where I sail. I mean there's not all that much to go wrong with an old motor like that if it's taken care of. Sure it's not as cool looking as a new one. I sure would like electric start though. But that's not enough of a reason... ;- )

2004 250WB #781

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4299 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2021 : 21:14:30

Keep in mind even a new motor can have a problem.

I agree with Kemp. Run them until you lose confidence in it.

When I was a kid we had a 17' tri-hull powerboat with a 100HP Evinrude. Had that motor for nearly 20 years. We ski'd probably 500 miles with that motor over the years. It was either idling or wide open, nothing in between. All we did to it was change the plugs and gear oil on a regular basis and run the carbs dry when we put the boat up at the end of the weekend. When we sold the boat it ran like it did when it was new, started with a quick flip of the key every time.

I have a 1989 Suzuki 8HP 2 cycle on my boat now and it starts on the 2nd or 3rd pull every time (even after it's been sitting for 4 or 5 months during the winter). I run the carb dry every time I put it up.

Feed them fresh clean gas, run the carbs dry every time, change the gear oil once in a while, flush the motor after every use if you're in salt water, keep the water pump working and you should get many more years of service out of the motor you have now.

Association Member

GaryB
Andiamo
'89 SR/WK #5862
Kemah,TX

Edited by - GaryB on 08/04/2021 21:16:45

HappyNow
1st Mate

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USA
99 Posts

Response Posted - 08/08/2021 : 13:23:42

I have a 1998 Honda and it starts first pull, plenty of power. But I wanted to add something the previous owner told me- - old motors don�t get stolen. I�m not in an area where theft is a problem since I�m on a buoy and the engine is locked to the transom, but that might be a consideration in keeping your old motor running.

Michael Levin
Sailin' on Sunshine
C250 #402 WK
Lake Tahoe

Dave Brown
Navigator

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USA
174 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2021 : 15:19:24

Motors, they all work , they all get you around the lake, or bay.
BUT , here�s what one should look for, who�s going to fix or service the thing !!
Don�t let some one sell, or talk you into buying brand X, if no one in the area
sells, fix�s, or has a dealership in the area, don�t buy it.
In my area, one can walk down the dock and count 5 different brands,
but the only dealer in the area in Mercury. And that�s ALL they work on !!
And yes, I have a Honda, and the nearest dealer is �� + 300 miles away .
Good luck.

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