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 250 wb headsail size		  New Topic  Reply to Topic
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Oneday
Deckhand

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USA
20 Posts
Initially Posted - 04/12/2022 :  02:51:17  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
What size headsail would you water ballast folks recommend? And if sailing with just one sail which one would you use? Thanks Dan

DavidCrosby
Navigator

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USA
229 Posts
Response Posted - 04/12/2022 :  06:08:17  Show Profile  Visit DavidCrosby's Homepage  Reply with Quote
My recommendation for WK or CB is 110% max.
David Crosby "Small World"
'02 C250 WK #614
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alippold
Deckhand

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USA
22 Posts
Response Posted - 04/12/2022 :  13:59:24  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I modified my WB to handle a 135. It is on a roller furler so can be easily reefed smaller when the winds pipe up.
Amber Waves
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Oneday
Deckhand

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USA
20 Posts
Response Posted - 04/12/2022 :  14:46:27  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Amber, Do the sheets for the 135 have to be run further aft than the cabin top? Did you add blocks? Cleats? thanks
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Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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USA
833 Posts
Response Posted - 04/12/2022 :  22:45:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Daniel,

It depends on which year your C250WB was built.
Can you post the year or hull number?

Early models have the chain plates attached at the hull/deck joint.
They have short (about 2-foot) jib tracks.

Later models have the chain plates on the cabin top (same as the wing-keel)
They have longer (about 5-foot) jib tracks.

Both models have a 110% jib as standard.
The later model had a 135% jib as an upgrade.
Russ Johnson
2005 C250WB Hull 793
Edited by - Russ.Johnson on 04/13/2022 19:38:27
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alippold
Deckhand

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USA
22 Posts
Response Posted - 04/13/2022 :  04:57:24  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
My WB is a 1995 which is an early model per Russ's previous post. I purchased new sails several years ago from Catalina Direct and worked with their technical support to figure out the required changes. It took a local machine shop, some help from the local boat yard and a friend who is very knowledgeable in doing boat mods to implement this. Here is a link to the diagram Catalina Direct provided to make the 135 sails work. https://www.mywebquilter.com/amberwaves/C-250%20Deck%20Hardware%20for%20135%20or%20150%20genoajpg.pdf

I followed the diagram pretty closely. The only major change I made is mounting a padeye instead of a cheek block. I attached a ratchet block to the padeye. The mounting point for the padeye is reachable from the interior via the standard port holds in the liner. The padeye is mounted on a block of marine grade HDPE to raise it up. I have used this setup for several years and it works well. I just installed new self tailing winches by the helm so am looking forward to trying them out this season. Still waiting for the ice to melt off the lake up here!
Amber Waves
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Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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USA
833 Posts
Response Posted - 04/13/2022 :  19:37:30  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Amber,

Thanks for the update.
I wondered how that would work on an early model.

Thanks, Russ
Russ Johnson
2005 C250WB Hull 793
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zeil
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1297 Posts
Response Posted - 04/14/2022 :  09:46:40  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

excellent information... thank you

Henk & Johanna
"Floating", a few off your "barnacles".
"Someday Lady" '95 C250WB #151 ('03 - 2016)
"Sea ya" 30ft Bayliner (04-2018 - 09-2018)
"Mariah" '96 C250WB #191 (05-2019 - 15-05-2023)
"Lady J" '00 C250WK #499 (05-2021 - 09-2022)
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Commodore
Russ Johnson

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USA
690 Posts
Response Posted - 04/15/2022 :  16:39:49  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Amber,

I would like to submit your project to the Mainsheet quarterly magazine.
It would be in the C250 Technical section.
I'll email you with the details.
Russ Johnson, Commodore 2009-2022 (commodore at catalina-capri-25s.org)
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Oneday
Deckhand

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USA
20 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  05:06:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So if its a later model, 2001, and has the longer tracks, then it should accommodate the 135 without any changes necessary?

quote:
Originally posted by Russ.Johnson

Daniel,

It depends on which year your C250WB was built.
Can you post the year or hull number?

Early models have the chain plates attached at the hull/deck joint.
They have short (about 2-foot) jib tracks.

Later models have the chain plates on the cabin top (same as the wing-keel)
They have longer (about 5-foot) jib tracks.

Both models have a 110% jib as standard.
The later model had a 135% jib as an upgrade.
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JB
Navigator

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USA
110 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  09:12:49  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm not sure if I have a 2003 or 2004 wing keel. I have the longer track, inboard standing rigging and a 135 jib. The close haul sheeting angle isn't perfect but after sailing a few times I decided I could live with it. Another consideration of the 135 and inboard rigging is that there is a point where you have to route the lines outside the standing rigging to avoid chaffing.
1988 C25 Wing Keel Std Rig Tohatsu 9.9 Tiller Steering and 2003 C250 Wing Keel Std Rig Inboard Diesel Wheel Steering
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Oneday
Deckhand

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USA
20 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  09:55:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks, do you have any photos close hauled?


quote:
Originally posted by JB

I'm not sure if I have a 2003 or 2004 wing keel. I have the longer track, inboard standing rigging and a 135 jib. The close haul sheeting angle isn't perfect but after sailing a few times I decided I could live with it. Another consideration of the 135 and inboard rigging is that there is a point where you have to route the lines outside the standing rigging to avoid chaffing.
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JB
Navigator

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USA
110 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  10:12:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Sorry no. We've only had the boat one season. We won't be going until June, if we're lucky.
1988 C25 Wing Keel Std Rig Tohatsu 9.9 Tiller Steering and 2003 C250 Wing Keel Std Rig Inboard Diesel Wheel Steering
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Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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USA
833 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  10:23:12  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Daniel,

Let me clarify.
Here’s a photo from the original sales brochure (see the Manuals & Brochures on the left menu).
This is a 1995 “early model” water ballast with a 110% jib
Notice the chainplates are at the deck/hull joint and the jib sheets are run inside of the shouds.
If you have an early model, you can use Amber’s drawing to add hardware to use a bigger jib.

All winged-keels models and later water-ballast models have the chainplates on the cabin top.
Those models can use either a 110% or 135% jib without any hardware changes.
Russ Johnson
2005 C250WB Hull 793
Edited by - Russ.Johnson on 04/17/2022 10:38:10
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alippold
Deckhand

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USA
22 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  12:45:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
With the 135 on my boat the close hauled sheeting angle isn't great. I rigged a barber hauler using a little car on the old jib tracks to pull in the foot of the sail. I use this when I am racing :)
Amber Waves
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Oneday
Deckhand

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USA
20 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  15:13:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ok, now something I’ve never heard of. A barber hauler. I googled it but still unsure how to rig it.

quote:
Originally posted by alippold

With the 135 on my boat the close hauled sheeting angle isn't great. I rigged a barber hauler using a little car on the old jib tracks to pull in the foot of the sail. I use this when I am racing :)
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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5851 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  15:42:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here's a link to a good article that explains "barber haulers" and "tweakers." http://bestsailingtips.epizy.com/the-barber-hauler-user-guide/?i=1
Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore
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Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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USA
833 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  18:20:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Daniel,

Here’s a link to a recent post.
The photo inside the cabin, shows the supports under the cabin top chain plates.
These supports are installed on all wing-keel models and the later water-ballast models.
The early water ballast models (like Amber’s) wouldn’t have these supports.

https://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=32269
Russ Johnson
2005 C250WB Hull 793
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Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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USA
833 Posts
Response Posted - 04/17/2022 :  18:31:34  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I posted Amber’s diagram in the Photo Gallery - C250 Section
Thanks, Amber


Russ Johnson
2005 C250WB Hull 793
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