Association Forum - Sinking Orientation

Assn Members Area · Join

Home.

Association Forum

Ships Store

Cruising

Racing

Technical Tips

Photo Gallery - New

Boat Search - Updated

Manuals & Brochures

Swap Meet

Links

Officer Flag Line & Staff

Bylaws & Constitution

Members Area

Join the Association

Notice:
The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.

Association Forum

Username:	Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

All Forums

Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Sinking Orientation

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Author

Topic

sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

Member Avatar

814 Posts

Initially Posted - 04/20/2015 : 19:58:32

Will an unladen C25 sink bow or stern first? I'm thinking bow first because many C25s float at their moorings with their bows lower in the water than their sterns, but that might be due loading.

I'm asking in relation to placement of a new 4000 gph bilge pump, to be under the aft-end of the v-berth or in the bilge behind the companionway. I'm leaning toward under the v-berth but I'm not sure.

Thanks.

Seth
"Outlier" 1987 Catalina 25 SR/SK/Traditional Interior #5541
"Zoo" 1977 Morgan Out Island 30
"Nomad" 1980 Prindle 16
"Lost" 1988 Catalina Capri 14.2 (sold - yay!)
"Marine Tex 1" Unknown Origin POS 8' Fiberglass Dinghy
https://whichsailboat.com/2014/07/27/catalina-25-review/

Edited by - sethp001 on 04/20/2015 20:00:22

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 04/20/2015 : 20:21:05

The v-berth compartments are closed to the bilge and thus floation of a sort, but the rest of the hull back to the transom is not. I suspect it would go down stern first. Then again, sailboat sinkings I've seen videos of showed the mast upright until it disappeared--probably because the ballast kept it that way. But what you want to know is where water will collect long before that. I know the answer for a fin keel, but not precisely for the swinger (keel up or down).

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Lee Panza
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 04/20/2015 : 21:53:31

quote:
Originally posted by sethp001

Will an unladen C25 sink bow or stern first?

I sincerely hope that nobody has a good answer to this question based on personal experience.

That having been said, I can share what related experience I do have.

One afternoon in the bouncy conditions we typically see in SF Bay all summer, my tiller started to feel strange and the rudder seemed a bit sloppy. When I looked over the transom I saw that two of the bolts holding the lower gudgeon to the hull were gone, and the third was dramatically bent. So it meant the end of sailing for that day and a long motor home.

A little while after getting the sails down and starting to motor peacefully my girlfriend pointed to water running across the sole of the saloon and asked why it was there. It was coming from under the lower drawer under the galley sink, and the area behind the companionway steps was filled to that level. I wasn't too surprised, with two and a half 1/4-inch holes submerged due to the slight squatting from the thrust of the outboard. And I judged from the rate of flow that we could easily make it back to the ramp (I "dry-sail" the boat while I'm gradually fixing it up, so I usually haul it out after I use it). I guess, in retrospect, that it was a mistake to try to explain to my girlfriend that it was no big deal, but "...technically, we're sinking."

The look on my girlfriend's face, as she fixated on that flowing water for a very silent five minutes or so, convinced me to pull into a marina we were passing and stuff some quick-setting epoxy in those holes.

During the time that the water was flowing across the saloon sole and gathering in front of the head I realized that that would be the place to mount an electric bilge pump. And it would have to be done before I would even think about asking my girlfriend to go out there with me again!

As an Engineer I like redundancy in important systems, so I mounted two pumps there (see the picture below). The smaller one is rated at 1000 GPH and the larger at 4000 GPH. The smaller one has an internal switch and I mounted an external switch for the large one on the bulkhead next to it (both switches are solid state electronic sensors, rather than float-switches). The smaller pump is for the nuisance inflows - when I'm "technically sinking" but it's not really a major concern at the moment. The bigger pump is for when the swing keel drops and breaks a big hole or when a through-hull or hose fails, and the switch for it is mounted high enough that the saloon sole would be awash before it kicks in. Both also operate from manual switches in case the electronic ones fail (like I said, I like redundancy).

So, to test the setup, I dropped a hose into the saloon over at the guest dock, and I turned it on. The smaller pump kept up with the hose by itself, so I turned the breaker off in order to get enough water in to give the larger pump a test. When the entire sole was covered, including the raised portion under the dinette table, the big pump kicked-in. Like, it really, really kicked. Outside, the flow coming out the transom outlet was like a firehose. I subsequently put a large clamshell vent over it to keep it from dousing my outboard motor.

I'm relating all of this because on both occasions - the rudder "incident" and my test of the pumps - the boat continued to float level. My belief, now, is that the boat would settle more or less level fore-and-aft if the water is free to circulate through all of the interconnected compartments. Therefore, the ideal place for the pump (pumps) is at that lowest accessible spot in front of the head.

The natural response might be "doesn't that interfere with using the head?" And the answer would be - no.

Even with those two pumps that I have, there's more than enough room for both of my size twelves, pointed either direction as I use the facility.

My feeling is that anything as important as your bilge pump (pumps) should be very readily accessible, so you can maintain them. It's important to keep debris (or shifted stuff that was stowed nearby) away from them, and it's a good idea to check them occasionally. Manual switches allow me to flick them on from time to time for that reassuring sound of 5000 GPH (83.3 gallons every minute) of backup.

Incidentally, pumps are rated for discharge at zero head of back pressure; that 4000 GPH pump probably won't output much more than 3000 due to the vertical rise of a couple of feet and the almost 15 feet of 2" hose leading to the transom outlet. Smaller pumps should be similarly de-rated.

So, I hope that's the most knowledgeable answer you get to your question about which end would go down first. If someone else has some more direct and conclusive experience to share I'd be sad, but quite interested, to hear it.

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

Edited by - Lee Panza on 04/20/2015 22:17:06

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

3474 Posts

Response Posted - 04/21/2015 : 04:03:57

That helped me... I was just going over the placement in my boat, and it would work out best in the bilge under the board I cut and added hinges to for easy access to the bilge.

Thank you, and thanks Lee..

Ray in Atlanta, Ga.
"Lee Key" '84 Catalina 25
Standard Rig / Fin Keel

hewebb
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
761 Posts

Response Posted - 04/21/2015 : 05:48:58

My boat is a wing keel and I have mine mounted in the approximate center of the hull where the keel bolts are. That seems to be the lowest part of the bilge. Also, that is where the factory manual pick up is. Not sure where that would be on a swing keel. You could add water to the bilge to see where it collects first. When I cleaned my bilge I used a drill powered pump to remove the water.

1988 WK/SR w/inboard diesel Joe Pool Lake
Hobie 18 Lake Worth

Life is not a dress rehearsal. You will not get another chance.

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 04/21/2015 : 07:15:06

Lee, are you saying you're putting the pump(s) in the salon/head rather than in the bilge below it? Why?

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

DavidBuoy
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
707 Posts

Response Posted - 04/21/2015 : 07:26:04

The whole layout of the bilge/holds is rather silly to me. It is sectioned of/not connected to any of the areas that have thru-hulls or areas that are suspect to possible water intrusion. Not only that but the way the floor slopes toward the head and toward the galley, its almost like they wanted to keep the water away from the bilge. I've honestly considered drilling from each hold into the bilge so that if water starts coming in from anywhere it goes there... where my pump is. I know a number of people have installed pumps in each hold etc. etc., which is great for redundancy, but a lot of trouble and complexity.

Captain Rob & Admiral Alyson
"David Buoy"-1985 C25 SK/SR #5053

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

Members Avatar

USA
3754 Posts

Response Posted - 04/21/2015 : 09:16:03

I ordered a second high volume pump last week at WM's 40% off sale and plan to put it at the aft end of the saloon. The ribs in the bilge do not have limber holes so you can't get the water below the tops of the ribs in any section without a pump. I think the precise location is moot, so wherever you want it is the best location.

Dave B. aboard Pearl
1982 TR/SK/Trad. #3399
Lake Erie/Florida Panhandle

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1736 Posts

Response Posted - 04/26/2015 : 07:10:34

Interesting thread.

My boat, thank God, has never taken water through the hull -- but it does have various window/companionway leaks that after a hard rain will lead to some water congregating on the sole both by the galley (depressed curve design) and by the head, which is lower than the rest of the cabin sole. Therefore, yes, if the goal is to get any water that is above the sole, and you are not sailing with a heal, then those two lowest areas are best for a pump. However, the goal, IMHO, is to not enable the water to get to the point that it is above the sole but instead have repetitive systems in a place, or multiple places in the bilge where water would first collect. I would suggest an electric pump or two in the lowest area(s) under the sole in the bilge that in ANY HEAL would operate and then have a manual pump with adequate hose that could be manually moved if necessary in the bilge. If you need a 400 gph pump located above the cabin sole, you have other issues that are far more important to address than adding a pump for back-up.

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 04/26/2015 : 09:00:55

Also, there's a minimum depth of water that will activate an automatic pump and to which the pump will reduce the level before turns off (or sucks air if switched on manually). If I were worried about those two low spots being wet, I'd probably put some small drain holes in each, and pick up the water in the bilge. My fin keel hull pretty much allowed everything to migrate to the keel sump (except from the v-berth and dinette lockers). I'm not familiar with the structure under the sole of a swing-keeler, but a few limber holes could be the solution. Then you probably have two low points--each side of the keel trunk.

Having the pump(s) in the bilge is also your best and earliest protection from a real problem (leaky thru-hull or something else that can sink the boat).

I applaud those who have achieved bone-dry bilges. I never did.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Lee Panza
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 04/27/2015 : 06:56:31

quote:
Originally posted by Stinkpotter

Lee, are you saying you're putting the pump(s) in the salon/head rather than in the bilge below it? Why?

The main reason I didn't cut through the sole to drop the pumps all the way down to the inner surface of the hull is that I want them readily accessible for clearing debris from around the cages. The sole is very close to the hull at that location anyway, so what little water accumulates there isn't much of a worry.

When I drilled the holes for the hoses through the step-up in the inner liner (under the porta-potty, behind the wood step that Catalina installed to extend the platform for a porta-potty instead of a flushing marine head), that created limber holes from the dead space under the head.

It's admittedly unusual to have your bilge pumps out in the open like this, and some would not want to see them or the hoses, but considering how important they are, and how important it is to keep them operational, my personal preference was functionality over appearance. If they're in one of the lockers under the settees (in a swing-keel model you'd need pumps on both sides) they will almost inevitably be surrounded by "stuff" that gets stowed in the lockers, making it impossible to conveniently check the cages for accumulations of debris.

One of the takeaways I've picked up from reading horror stories about cruising is that when disaster strikes and the boat starts taking serious water a big problem is that the pump intakes get at least partially blocked, dangerously reducing their effectiveness. Even if you don't have loose debris (often leftover from the original construction), paper labels come off cans or other containers and plastic wrappings come loose when there's water sloshing around where it wasn't expected to be.

And that sorta' leads back to the topic of this thread. When the bilge pumps can't do their job we might get to find out which end goes down last

The trouble with a destination - any destination, really - is that it interrupts The Journey.

Lee Panza
SR/SK #2134
San Francisco Bay
(Brisbane, CA)

pearson39b
1st Mate

Members Avatar

93 Posts

Response Posted - 04/27/2015 : 10:15:38

Additional considereation: I've often heard it said - never verified - that most boat sinkings occur at the dock. If that is - in fact - the case, a central point or points, might be much preferable to one located at either end, as mooring lines could influence at what angle and how fast the boat goes down and how far it goes down.

Sailor Jerry
C-25 "Sea Song"
1978, SK, Std.
Pepin, WI

sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

Members Avatar

814 Posts

Response Posted - 05/08/2015 : 15:45:41

Thanks guys!

sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

Members Avatar

814 Posts

Response Posted - 03/20/2016 : 16:18:20

quote:
Originally posted by Lee Panza

quote:
Originally posted by sethp001

Will an unladen C25 sink bow or stern first?

Incidentally, pumps are rated for discharge at zero head of back pressure; that 4000 GPH pump probably won't output much more than 3000 due to the vertical rise of a couple of feet and the almost 15 feet of 2" hose leading to the transom outlet. Smaller pumps should be similarly de-rated.

Lee, were you able to find a 2" I.D. vented loop for the discharge on your larger pump? And if so, where did you get yours? I've only been able to find one very expensive fitting.

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 03/20/2016 : 18:24:15

Boats are designed so that all but perhaps a small amount of water that gets inside the boat will drain into the bilge, which is the lowest space in the boat. All your bilge pumps should be there. If you install your bilge pumps on the saloon floor, then the bilge will fill with water and the water in the saloon will rise above your ankles before the pumps even turn on, and the pumps will turn off as soon as the water is below the level of the bilge pump switch. That will leave tons of water inside the cabin. Since the boat's displacement is about 4500 pounds, it will be close to foundering. You need to get all that water out of the boat.

If the pumps are in the bilge, then they will begin pumping water out when it is only a few inches deep in the bilge. Unless the water in getting inside the boat faster than 4000 gph, the water level will never rise above the cabin floor. If the pumps are in the cabin, and not in the bilge, then how will you get the rest of the water out of the cabin when the water level declines to the on-off switch, at about ankle-deep?

Lee made a good point. Bilge pumps can get clogged by debris, so the pump should have a filter. Also, you want to be able to unclog the filter easily. The C25 floorboard over the bilge is screwed down. It would be good to either fit it with some sort of latch that enables you to open and close it easily, and without tools, so that you can clean out the filter, or, alternatively, mount the filter someplace where it will be easily accessible for cleaning.

On my C&C 35, the factory mounted the electric bilge pump itself in an easily accessible locker, but the take-up hoses for both the manual and electric bilge pumps are in the deepest part of the bilge.

My Cal 25 only has a manual bilge pump, and the factory-installed take up hose for it is also in the deepest part of the bilge.

The pumps (or the take up hoses for the pumps, if they're that kind of pump) need to be in the bilge. It doesn't really matter whether the boat will sink by the bow or the stern. The objective is to prevent it from sinking at all. But, I think the answer to the question is that the boat will probably sink first at whichever end is the heaviest. If you have lots of heavy stuff stowed in the v berth, it'll probably sink bow first, although it might sink first at whichever end has a big hole in it.

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

Members Avatar

814 Posts

Response Posted - 03/20/2016 : 18:35:19

Thanks Steve. I'm putting in a Rule 4000 gph model in the bilge beneath the companionway steps. Do you know where I can source a 2" I.D. vented loop?

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 03/20/2016 : 19:00:11

Can't help you. The biggest I found is 1 1/2", made by Forespar, at Jamestown Distributors.

If you want to prevent water from flowing back into the bilge after the pump shuts off, you could put a check valve in the hose.

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

SKS
Navigator

Members Avatar

USA
161 Posts

Response Posted - 03/21/2016 : 11:27:48

What am I missing here ?
Isn't the best place for a bilge pump.......in the bilge ?
That's where water collects in my boat.

"Lady E" 1986 Catalina 25: Fin Keel, Standard Rig, Inboard M12 Diesel, Sail No. 5339
Sailing out of Norwalk Cove Marina, Connecticut

Edited by - SKS on 03/21/2016 11:29:04

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 03/21/2016 : 14:49:56

quote:
Originally posted by Steve Milby

...If you want to prevent water from flowing back into the bilge after the pump shuts off, you could put a check valve in the hose.

Everything I've seen (except from check-valve sellers) recommends against check valves in bilge pump hoses. The weight of the water beyond the valve can make it hard for the pump to open it, and it can reduce pumping efficiency. Yes, a little water tends to flow back when the pump turns off, and a vented loop can reduce that (except for water between the vent and the pump), but an automatic pump isn't going to get everything anyway. Based on how mine operates, I deduce that the pump turns on at a higher water level than it turns off, so a little back-flow doesn't make it cycle on/off forever. And the backflow might be helpful for keeping the cage (intake filter) clear.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 03/21/2016 15:02:49

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 03/21/2016 : 16:04:12

quote:
Originally posted by Stinkpotter

quote:
Originally posted by Steve Milby

...If you want to prevent water from flowing back into the bilge after the pump shuts off, you could put a check valve in the hose.
Everything I've seen recommends against check valves in bilge pump hoses. Yes, a little water tends to flow back when the pump turns off, and a vented loop can reduce that (except for water between the vent and the pump), but an automatic pump isn't going to get everything anyway. Based on how mine operates, I deduce that the pump switches are designed to ignore some quantity of water that backflows so the pump doesn't cycle on/off forever. In other words, the pump turns on at a higher water level than it turns off.

My system doesn't work that way. Some pumps sit inside the bilge, and don't have a long hose that empties when the pump turns off. In fact, I think that type of electric bilge pump has a check valve built in to it, to prevent the backflow of water when it shuts off. [When I rebuilt my Whale Gusher 10 manual bilge pump, it had a rubber flap check valve built into it, for the same purpose.]

My C&C has a vented loop to prevent siphoning of water in through the thru hull valve. The pump is mounted in a locker that is separated about 7-8 ft. from the bilge, and about 2-3 ft. higher than the bilge. The hose runs to the bottom of the bilge. There's a strainer, with a built-in check valve on the end of the hose, to stop it from sucking in debris and to prevent water from backflowing into the bilge. [The strainer/check valve is made by Whale and sold by Westmarine. http://www.westmarine.com/buy/whale-pumps--plastic-bilge-strainers--P000225912] There's another, finer strainer just before the pump, to catch finer particles and protect the pump.

When the pump shuts off, the water drains out of the pump and out of the 7-8 ft long hose and back into the bilge, unless there's a check valve to stop it. That amount of water is enough to cause the pump to start again, and the result is that the pump cycles on and off, again and again. The only solution is to either turn it on and off manually, or install a check valve to prevent the backflow, so that I can leave it in automatic mode, and it will turn itself on and off as necessary.

There's a good article on the Cruising World website that discusses the subject. It says, "Check valves are prohibited by the American Boat & Yacht Council for use as an anti-siphon device-and with good reason: They're notorious for failing in both the open and the closed position, which respectively leads to flooding or failure to pump. Check valves may be used, though, to prevent water from a long hose from flowing back to the bilge". http://www.cruisingworld.com/how/wire-and-plumb-your-bilge-pump-properly

On my boat, the vented loop is my anti-siphon device. The check valve is used to prevent the water from the long hose from flowing back into the bilge.

The reason why a check valve can be used in one place but not the other is that, if used in place of an anti-siphon device, a check valve can sink your boat if it fails, and it can happen at any time without warning. When used to stop the backflow into the bilge, the worst it is likely to do if it fails is prevent your pump from pumping, or from shutting off. That consequence is not likely to sink the boat, and is about the same degree of seriousness as if the pump motor burned out or the switch failed, or the battery lost it's charge.

Whether you need a check valve depends on whether your pump has one built-in, and where the pump is mounted.

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

Edited by - Steve Milby on 03/21/2016 18:44:51

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 03/21/2016 : 20:04:04

quote:
Originally posted by Steve Milby

There's a good article on the Cruising World website that discusses the subject...

(It) goes on to say, "However, be warned: If the valve is close to the pump, the pump may not be able to overcome the weight of the water on the other side of the valve, rendering the pump ineffective."

quote:
[When I rebuilt my Whale Gusher 10 manual bilge pump, it had a rubber flap check valve built into it, for the same purpose.]

Manual pumps have two check-valves because that's how they work. The exit check valve allows the bellows to pull water from the entrance hose, and the entrance check valve forces the water to exit the bellows through the exit hose. The designer was confident you would able to overcome the weight of the water in the exit hose.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 03/21/2016 21:02:22

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 03/22/2016 : 05:38:48

On my boat the valve is not close to the pump, and my bilge pump is a diaphram pump, not a centrifugal pump. A diaphram pump has the power to open a check valve, even if it is stuck. A centrifugal pump, such as a Rule pump, does not. The manufacturer of Rule pumps specifically recommends against the use of a check valve with their pump.

Maine Sail is the online identity of a sailor who is widely recognized on several sailing forums as an expert in sailboat systems. He discussed this subject. In discussing check valves, he said: "These valves quite often stick shut especially if the bilge pump does not cycle often. The biggest draw back is the added head pressure that the pump can not overcome. This additional head is caused by the standing water in the discharge hose, and thus, a centrifugal pump will simply cavitate and do nothing but make some neat little bubbles in the bilge." He went on to say: "The largest maker of centrifugal bilge pumps, Rule, specifically recommends not to use them." But, he does not have the same concern about diaphram pumps. He said: "Check valves on rotary vane pumps or diaphragm pumps do not suffer the issues they do on centrifugal Rule style pumps."

Later, Maine Sail distinguished centrifugal pumps from diaphram pumps: "I would NEVER, and I don't use the word never often, recommend a check valve on a single pump installation when a centrifugal pump is being used. If you want a check valve please use a rotary vane or diaphragm pump that has the ability to deal with the head pressure of the standing water and to push open a sticky check valve." See posts number 5 and 8 in this link. http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/93937-bilge-pump-non-return-valve.html

All bilge pumps are not alike. When selecting a pump, you have to choose the type that is suitable to your application. The long hose from the bilge to the pump on my boat requires a check valve in the bilge to stop the backflow, and that requires the use of a diaphram pump.

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3312 Posts

Response Posted - 03/22/2016 : 15:06:51

I don't know if this is any help, but when our C22 sank she went down level...but then she had broached.

Derek Crawford
Chief Measurer C25-250 2008
Previous owner of "This Side UP"
1981 C-25 TR/FK #2262 Used to have an '89 C22 #9483, "Downsized"
San Antonio, Texas

Topic

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Jump To:

Association Forum

Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.