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When to turn on running lights

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Captain Max
1st Mate

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USA
87 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/28/2014 : 06:48:03

Is it clearly defined when running lights are turned on? For some reason I thought it was one half hour before sunset. Can't find an official reference.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 07:18:25

Boat US says, "Vessels are required to show the proper navigation lights from sunset to sunrise in all weather conditions, good and bad... The Rules also state that navigation lights must be shown in conditions of reduced visibility, and may be shown at other times considered necessary." http://www.boatus.org/guide/navigation_16.html

Edited by - Steve Milby on 08/28/2014 07:19:36

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 07:49:41

Another way to look at is is, about the only time you specifically should not have your red/green running lights on is when at anchor or on a mooring. Otherwise, if in doubt, make your self noticeable--show your lights.

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Captain Max
1st Mate

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USA
87 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 09:37:07

I probably picked the half hour before from sunset from someone who was saying to error on safe side. After all, the definition is a little vague and somewhat open to interpretation. For example, when clouds hide the actual sunset. It is a no brainer to have your lights on in when visibility is effected. I would hope everyone boating would know that.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 17:45:19

A lot of my early evening travel is in high-traffic areas past anchorages and marinas, with many smaller and much larger boats. If I notice anybody's running lights, it's the signal to turn mine on (if they aren't already). Avoiding surprises is the first priority.

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sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

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814 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 19:14:11

Not everyone will agree with this because it's technically wrong, but we burn all of our lights (running plus two on the mast) when motoring or sailing after sunset (to be clear what I mean, sorry if obvious, when we still have light to see, but sun has passed over the horizon). I saw another sailboat do this, and what I liked about it was that that with two lights burning on the mast it was clear to power boaters that it was a sailboat. Sailboats under power have no more right of way than power boats, but I've noticed power boats still give extra leeway when they recognize its a sailboat, even when the sailboat is operating under power.

I'm technically wrong, but think it adds to safety.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 19:43:55

quote:
Originally posted by sethp001

... we burn all of our lights (running plus two on the mast) when motoring or sailing after sunset... I'm technically wrong, but think it adds to safety.

...until you meet a sailboat that sees you as being under power (steaming light on) while you consider yourself to have "rights" of a sailboat (starboard tack). A couple of last-second head-fakes, and crunch--you're at fault. (Really, as well as "technically.") Your steaming light makes you a powerboat whether your motor is running or not.

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sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

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814 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 19:45:16

quote:
Originally posted by Stinkpotter

quote:
Originally posted by sethp001

... we burn all of our lights (running plus two on the mast) when motoring or sailing after sunset... I'm technically wrong, but think it adds to safety.
...until you meet a sailboat that sees you as being under power (steaming light on) while you consider yourself to have "rights" of a sailboat (starboard tack). A couple of last-second head-fakes, and crunch--you're at fault. (Really, as well as "technically.") Your steaming light makes you a powerboat whether your motor is running or not.

Yup, but when I see no sails...

Edited by - sethp001 on 08/28/2014 19:50:33

dasreboot
Admiral

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803 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 07:23:55

i turn on steaming light only with the motor. anchor light only while anchored. I shine a spotlight on the sails when people come close, or I turn on the foredeck light.

I thought uv blacklights pointed at the sails would be neat. Then I would look like a ghost ship!

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 10:56:48

Pointing a flashlight on your sails at night when another boat approaches is always a good idea. Turn on the steaming light only when motoring.

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Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3754 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2014 : 21:19:32

Turning on more lights makes you more visible, but eliminates the information the the proscribed lights convey to other skippers. Light it right so I know what I'm dealing with.

Edit:
The half hour thing is common in state highway laws, possibly the source of the misinformation. Of course the differences between nautical, civil, and astronomical sunset can add to the confusion.

Edited by - Dave5041 on 09/03/2014 21:23:15

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2014 : 22:36:35

When a collision occurs that causes significant loss, injury or death, the two skippers generally end up before a state admiralty court. It's likely (though not certain) that both will be assigned a percentage of responsibility. The court will look at conditions, boat operation, and measures taken to avoid the collision, and assign percentages based on various factors. If, for example, a collision was at dusk (everything visible but in somewhat dim light) and one boat had running lights on while the other did not, the latter skipper might have a small percentage added to his total for the lack of lights. If the accident is in darkness and one boat is unlighted, a much larger percentage will be added to that skipper's total. No "rules" (e.g. "lights not required before X time") will be considered as excuses for not taking all reasonable measures to avoid the collision.

For running lights, I go by the same principle as many use for reefing--the time to do it is when it first occurs to me. Often that's when a light on a boat or even on shore catches my eye--sometimes it's before that.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 09/03/2014 22:38:07

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5231 Posts

Response Posted - 09/04/2014 : 07:13:56

Sunset and sunrise are both exact times in any area. Times of twilight: astronomical, nautical and civil are much darker than the times of rise and set. Often if there are clouds, fog or haze, visibility will be further hampered well before sunset or after sunrise. I agree with David, when you first notice any lights coming on toward sunset, flip yours on and follow suit. Running you lights from pre-dawn into broad daylight will not hurt anything either. They're some of the cheapest insurance you have.

Edited by - Voyager on 09/04/2014 07:15:27

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3754 Posts

Response Posted - 09/04/2014 : 13:04:26

Yep. sorry. Sunset is when the upper limb appears to dip below the horizon, definitions of twilight vary by purpose.

Edited by - on

sdpinaz
Navigator

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USA
193 Posts

Response Posted - 09/04/2014 : 14:01:43

I think it is important to follow the rules. I only turn my anchor light on when anchored, my steaming light only when I am motoring, my bi-color/stern lights only when under way. I don't like to confuse people. To me, that is like driving down the road with my turn signal on because maybe someday I will turn right, just hoping someone doesn't tailgate me.....

Arizona is one of the dumbest states when it comes to knowing the rules of the road. Most boaters around here use their boats once or twice a year on memorial day/labor day and that's it. Too many drunk boat operators and kids on 'lake lice' that have never taken a safety course or even know they exist. Nonetheless, I still follow the rules of the road with the caveat that even with my lights, I am invisible to those idiots around me.....

Edited by - on

sdpinaz
Navigator

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USA
193 Posts

Response Posted - 09/04/2014 : 14:06:10

My favorite are the two teenagers, drunk as skunks, one driving looking back over his shoulder, the other one getting flipped about on a tube, zig-zagging at about 30 knots through the no wake or swim zone...... Happens EVERY time I go sailing on Arizona lakes on any holiday weekend...... And the lake lice are obnoxious, they should outlaw those things in Arizona.....
Cheers,
Scott

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5231 Posts

Response Posted - 09/05/2014 : 06:38:59

Agreed. I compare some drivers of lake lice akin to drivers of those buzz-bikes (motor scooters) you see everywhere now. Here you don't need a license or registration to drive a small motorcycle on the roads. I can't figure out who came up with that idea. On the jetskis however there's one that I'd love to have - it's a 4 seater jet boat. Looks like a party machine to me (oops! Did I say that?)

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 09/05/2014 : 13:49:45

quote:
Originally posted by Voyager

...Here (CT) you don't need a license or registration to drive a small motorcycle on the roads. I can't figure out who came up with that idea...

Nobody, because it's not true. In CT, on "Motor Driven Vehicles" 50 CCs and above, you must have a license and follow some specific rules having to do with speeds, etc. Under 50 CCs ("Pocket Bikes"), you cannot drive them on any public road, land, or sidewalk in CT--private property only.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 09/05/2014 13:51:52

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5231 Posts

Response Posted - 09/05/2014 : 17:25:12

Apparently, Dave, the street lice who ride them have no clue about the regs...

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 09/05/2014 : 20:29:06

But there's a remedy to that. A little kid rode a motorized car down the street at 15-20 mph in front of my car one day and then did a U-turn right in front of me... I was ready, but I was horrified--what if it had been (name your favorite delivery truck or speeding neighbor)... So I called the local gendarmes. His parents needed a message they would remember.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 09/06/2014 08:40:03

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5231 Posts

Response Posted - 09/06/2014 : 11:39:45

Apologies all for going OT on this thread. Back to the prior OT, today off West Haven CT will be the "Savin Rock Beach Brawl" JetSki race invitational championships! Oughta be awesomely pointless, but good times for those involved. I decided not to sign Passage up as a contestant or referee boat!!

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 09/06/2014 : 15:47:02

quote:
Originally posted by Voyager

...today off West Haven CT will be the "Savin Rock Beach Brawl" JetSki race invitational championships! Oughta be awesomely pointless, but good times for those involved. I decided not to sign Passage up as a contestant or referee boat!!

Hey, she coulda been a contendah!

Edited by - on

Captain Max
1st Mate

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USA
87 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2014 : 10:40:59

I've been told that here on ray Hubbard, tx, that they have actually given tickets for boats NOT using the anchor light under sail, that is so stupid based on what they were designed for.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 09/08/2014 : 13:40:17

quote:
Originally posted by Captain Max

I've been told that here on ray Hubbard, tx, that they have actually given tickets for boats NOT using the anchor light under sail, that is so stupid based on what they were designed for.

What's more, its specifically against the COLREGS--sorta like giving a traffic ticket for not having high beams on in traffic. If a white light is visible in combination with a running light from a boat approaching you, that boat is presenting itself as under power. If its skipper thinks he's a sailboat and should hold course when approaching a powerboat off to starboard, he's wrong--he's presenting himself as another powerboat. Same if he's on starboard tack approaching a sailboat off to port on a port tack. And in darkness, it just gets trickier.

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