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Is teak oil to be avoided?

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Catalississippi
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Initially Posted - 02/22/2020 : 20:48:15

Working on my drawers (which I had to rebuild) last summer, I bought a can of teak oil at the hardware store. Looks great / looked great once I finished them. I figured I'd start with the drawers and work my way up to the hatch boards and handrails, but all I've done so far on any wood refinishing is the drawers. Later, I was advised by an old salt in Grand Traverse Bay to "throw that stuff away." I can't remember what he suggested I use instead, but I know he did not advocate for teak oil.

From what I understand teak oil has its detractors because it can fade quickly and possibly attracts dirt and other particles? Or is it that teak needs to be reapplied regularly? I've also seen folks on here who use Cetol (which I know nothing about - supposedly more work to apply?) because it's longer lasting, I believe.

I've even seen the thread from last May where motor oil was suggested, much to my surprise: http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=31459&SearchTerms=teak,oil

What is the conventional wisdom the thoughts on refinishing the wood with regard to what specific finish to use? Is there an appreciable difference when you're talking about exterior wood hatches and rails versus interior wood surfaces?

1980 Catalina 25 TR/SK #2098 ?????
Former owner of 1982 Catalina 25 TR/SK #3081 Suzy-Q

Edited by - Catalississippi on 02/23/2020 15:38:48

Catalississippi
1st Mate

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Response Posted - 02/22/2020 : 20:49:22

I'll add that I did notice recently that the drawers seem to attract more mildew than other surfaces in my cabin - I realize that's due to the moisture in my boat (a topic for another day - I have 2 dehumidifiers running in her now), but still, none of the other interior wood surfaces seemed to have that issue compared to the drawers I refinished last summer. (I should add that I didn't use teak for the new drawer bottoms I had to cut and install - the old ones had rotted - I think I just used plywood.) Does this have anything to do with my chosen finish?

1980 Catalina 25 TR/SK #2098 ?????
Former owner of 1982 Catalina 25 TR/SK #3081 Suzy-Q

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 02/23/2020 : 07:15:48

I've never used teak oil on the interior wood. We used Old English furniture polish on the interior wood. I do use teak oil on the exterior wood, and keep the wood covered with a tarp. Helps the finish last longer. Does require periodic cleaning and annual or sometimes more often re-coating. I've heard (read) good things about Cetol, supposed to last a lot longer than teak oil. I believe several coats are recommended.

DavidP
1975 C-22 SK #5459 "Shadowfax" Fleet 52
PO of 1984 C-25 SK/TR #4142 "Recess"
Percy Priest Yacht Club, Hamilton Creek Marina, Nashville, TN

Voyager
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Response Posted - 02/23/2020 : 07:37:01

This discussion has come up a few times. Some folks use teak oil, some use Tung oil and a friend of mine loved Semko. But that�s mainly for exterior wood that faces the elements. I�ve had good luck with Sikkens Cetol. But as in everything you must do a good deal of preparation before using it.
Interesting that the areas where you used Teak oil seem more susceptible to mildew. Tung oil penetrates the surface, but then it skins over to produce a coating. That might help.
I would not use motor oil for anything, especially inside, due to the smells and potential contaminants in used motor oil.
I�ve been lucky using Cetol fro the exterior teak brightwork and Liquid Gold to clean and brighten the interior.
For mold, do you know about Concrobium? It�s available at the Home Center and not only removes the mold but kills the remaining spores to stop regrowth. According to the manufacturer it�s �all natural �, but so is arsenic...

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain � Milford, CT

Edited by - Voyager on 02/23/2020 07:39:14

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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3312 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2020 : 11:33:46

Anywhere in the humidity of the South, teak oil will mildew. Cetol seems to be the best for the outside teak and can be "touched up" as opposed to varnish which requires starting over. (I knew a lady in the marina in Port Aransas, Texas, who detailed boats for a living. She maintained that Cetol would last longer than varnish or any other finish in a marine environment. For the interior teak Howard's Restore-a-Finish worked wonders and had a pleasant aroma.
Just my 2c

Derek Crawford
Chief Measurer C25-250 2008
Previous owner of "This Side UP"
1981 C-25 TR/FK #2262 Used to have an '89 C22 #9483, "Downsized"
San Antonio, Texas

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2020 : 12:19:12

Some old salts say we should let exterior teak "go gray", which in a humid environment means going black down in the grain. Tung oil can leave a nice satin finish at first, but I'd found moisture attacks it, and would never use it on the exterior. Varnish looks great until it cracks and lets moisture get under it--then it must be completely removed and done over to look as good.

Cetol is sort of a middle ground between teak oil and varnish--it makes a nice satin finish that is softer than varnish, but very weather-proof, and as Derek says, it's easy to touch up and periodically overcoat. Its colors (there are several) are actually part of its UV protection. I liked the original Cetol Marine, and found their "Natural Teak" to be a little too yellow-ish. Cetol also offers a gloss finish to overcoat any of the others--not to be used by itself. I liked the regular satin. A friend liked Semco--he used a shade that protected the wood but looked almost like gray teak, and a little milky.

Inside, I liked Howard's Restorer, which just wipes on--I liked a light shade like oak so as not to darken the interior. An occasional wipe-down with a mild bleach solution and then re-coating with Howard's was quick and simple.

So many choices...

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 02/23/2020 12:21:07

Catalississippi
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Response Posted - 02/23/2020 : 15:41:41

Appreciate the replies. So what did Catalina use on these early-80s boats? Is it varnish? Teak oil? Both? I�m wondering how much if any varnish removal and/or sanding I need to do? My wood is all grey now, so I�m wondering if, over the last 10-30 years, the elements have not already removed all of the varnish for me

1980 Catalina 25 TR/SK #2098 ?????
Former owner of 1982 Catalina 25 TR/SK #3081 Suzy-Q

Edited by - Catalississippi on 02/23/2020 15:53:13

OLarryR
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Response Posted - 02/23/2020 : 17:13:56

I use Howard�s Restore a Finish for interior wood - Works great.

I use to use Cetol on exterior wood but have since refinished all exterior wood with Teak Oil. Teak oil on the exterior will fade if not continuously refreshed every couple of months. However, I made covers for all exterior wood and so far...I�mmstickinnwith teak oil. As long as the wood is protected from contaminants and the UV rays, it lasts a long time and then only needs a refresh coat which quick and easily accomplished......but...I do have to take off my Sunbrella trim covers each time I go sailing. Teak oil was last applied about 8 months ago. I was just out sailing yesterday and the teak looked great. This Spring I will only need to apply a refresh coat. The Sunbrella covers and Ext and Int wood are on my website - Click on photos indicating from 2019 and later.

Larry
'89 Robin's Nest#5820, Potomac River/Quantico, Va
http://catalina25.homestead.com/olarryr.html

bigelowp
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Response Posted - 02/23/2020 : 20:02:24

I have been told that for interior teak you should put a satin varnish on it. I have not done that as my boat is 40 yers old and interior teak would need to be cleaned and most likely treated to be uniform on color. So, I use teak oil very sparingly every other year to make it look "good" (not great) Exterior teak is a different story. I use teak oil every year -- clean all teak (rough job to get most, but not all black/gray cleaned off) and oil when cleaned. i add, sparingly, a little after one month so it looks good longer. I am in New England so teak looks great May through early August, then turns grey -- so I get most of my relatively short season. Some old salts I know tell me to just keep the teak grey as the wood will last forever if I do not clean every year. So, many opinions on a "simple" subject!. My goal is looking good at 20 ft. Interior just look reasonably good. If I had a Hallberg Rassey with all the teak I may do thing differently.

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/23/2020 : 21:18:24

quote:
Originally posted by bigelowp

...If I had a Hallberg Rassey with all the teak I may do thing differently.

...like hire a someone to detail it in a heated shed every winter.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 02/23/2020 21:19:05

Voyager
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Response Posted - 02/24/2020 : 06:00:50

Back on Cetol... You can touch up and repair chips and dings but after a few seasons it starts to look like, well, old plastic.
I might go one more season (this is season 3) since my house project is taking most of my free time.
Retreatment requires removing all the teak from the exterior of the boat including hand rails, companionway trim and crib boards, eyebrows and the scupper rings in the cockpit. Each piece must be sanded or chemically stripped (wear vinyl gloves). Cetol applied in 5-6 thin coats, then re-bed each piece with BoatLife polysulfide caulk, not 3M 5200 polyurethane marine adhesive.
That�s what I do anyway. Others have been successful using masking tape. They must know something that I don�t.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain � Milford, CT

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/24/2020 : 07:48:14

I found an easier way... HDPE from Plasteak. Replaced the exterior teak on my $+!nkp*+ (4 hand-rails) last year. Over! Done!

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

bigelowp
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Response Posted - 02/24/2020 : 12:47:22

I never quite got why anyone would do Cetol. The work that Bruce describes being done every 3-5 years seems too close to what you would do if you varnished and varnish will last longer. For years I had a boat with toms of Mahogany. One year I removed all wood, had it stripped, bleached and applied 12 coats of varnish. The project took most of a winter. But after ten years, with only minimal touch-up, the trim looked like new. The teak oil application I described above takes @2hours to clean the teak and @ 30-60 minutes to apply the oil. Yes, I do it annually, but I do not need to take the boat apart or use such caustic chemicals. And yes, Dave described the perfect solution -- hiring someone -- darned just need to hit the lottery!

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT

Catalississippi
1st Mate

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Response Posted - 02/25/2020 : 12:16:30

Well, just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!

Y�all have just about talked me back into teak oil. I�m not hearing the negatives I expected. We lightly pressure washed our boat last year, and it did a nice job of bringing some good looking color out of the hatch boards and handrails, albeit temporarily. But at least that seems serve the purpose of easily stripping/sanding down the wood in preparation for refinishing.

So apparently the mildew inside the cabin is on me for using teak oil on interior wood in the humid south, but surely exterior wood would not mildew down here, even with all of our humidity?

1980 Catalina 25 TR/SK #2098 ?????
Former owner of 1982 Catalina 25 TR/SK #3081 Suzy-Q

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/25/2020 : 22:09:55

This is a little off-topic, but relates to interior mildew control. When the cabin cools in the evening with humid daytime air inside, it �dews� on everything, which promotes mildew on every surface�especially the fabrics and the wood where mildew can feed most voraciously. One way to reduce this is by �exhaling� the moist air and replacing it with cooler outside air that has already dropped its moisture as dew outside. How do you do that without drawing down your battery? A �solar vent� like you see on the decks and hatches of boats all over the country. No wires, no power draw, and overnight air exchange as described. I have to admit I�ve only used one in a NE climate, but it has prevented condensation even with two people sleeping in my smaller cabin over cool New England nights when the cockpit and deck were soaked the next mornings.

Just a related thought...

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 02/25/2020 22:26:18

Derek Crawford
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Response Posted - 02/26/2020 : 09:24:55

"surely exterior wood would not mildew down here, even with all of our humidity?"
It sure as heck will! I only used teak oil on the exterior teak once. In the Texas heat and humidity it looked like a complete disaster after about a month. So I switched to Cetol and had no more teak problems.

Derek Crawford
Chief Measurer C25-250 2008
Previous owner of "This Side UP"
1981 C-25 TR/FK #2262 Used to have an '89 C22 #9483, "Downsized"
San Antonio, Texas

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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Response Posted - 02/26/2020 : 10:41:32

I bought my boat new. I'm fairly certain Catalina didn't build the wooden furniture (drawers, cabinets, pin rails, etc.) inside our boats. I'm likewise fairly certain that they were unfinished, raw teak. They had a reddish tinge that gave them a warm glow. I never touched my interior wood, although it could have benefitted from some attention after 23 years. I suspect a light sanding might have restored that original teak color inside.

Outside, I tried varnish, polyurethane and cetol. Overall, I thought cetol was easiest to apply and re-apply after 2-4 years. Whatever I used, it lasted far longer than for most people because I made sunbrella covers for my handrails and covered the coach roof with a tarp during the week and through the winter. Keeping the sun, rain and snow off the teak makes any finish last much longer. Making handrail covers is probably the easiest thing you can make for a boat, and it can be done with any home sewing machine. I also made a sunbrella cover for my hatchboards, and it was likewise very easy.

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

Catalississippi
1st Mate

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Response Posted - 02/27/2020 : 08:06:22

quote:
Originally posted by Derek Crawford

"surely exterior wood would not mildew down here, even with all of our humidity?"
It sure as heck will! I only used teak oil on the exterior teak once. In the Texas heat and humidity it looked like a complete disaster after about a month. So I switched to Cetol and had no more teak problems.

Interesting. So did you just brush the Cetol on directly over your teak-oiled exterior wood? Or did you do all the prep work described here?

1980 Catalina 25 TR/SK #2098 ?????
Former owner of 1982 Catalina 25 TR/SK #3081 Suzy-Q

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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3312 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2020 : 08:52:02

I bleached the teak to kill the mildew, washed it well, and sanded it to a smooth surface and then applied 3 coats of Cetol with 1 coat of gloss over it.

Derek Crawford
Chief Measurer C25-250 2008
Previous owner of "This Side UP"
1981 C-25 TR/FK #2262 Used to have an '89 C22 #9483, "Downsized"
San Antonio, Texas

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2020 : 09:55:37

I removed and sanded mine down to like-new teak, and then applied probably four coats of Cetol. Each year I would touch up thin or worn spots with a little foam brush. A few years after the original job, I lightly sanded everything (in place) and brushed on an overcoat. Masking tape is worthwhile--Cetol does a pretty permanent tint on gelcoat.

The exterior companionway trim was held by screws from the inside, under the interior trim. I think I left the bulkhead "wings" on when I removed the rest--I didn't want to remove the bungs to get to the screws. Catalina bedded the trim with brown goop that I managed to remove--I then re-bedded with polysulfide (Life Caulk). The handrails were held by a combination of maybe four bolts, and screws for the other feet. The bolts made re-installation easy since some bending is required. I was careful not to try to get the nuts too tight so as not to turn the bolts under their bungs (which I never removed).

The first job was a labor of lust...

When the lust declined to love, the ease of touching up Cetol in place was appreciated.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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1736 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2020 : 20:40:04

"The first job was a labor of lust... When the lust declined to love, the ease of touching up Cetol in place was appreciated. "

Hear ya, but I am a minimalist and stick to the 20 ft rule. Teak oil, in CT looks great for three months, decent for another three months, but that is when winter storage begins. In the end, it really depends on personal preference. I know someone who thinks even teak oil "ruins" teak. Others I know expect 12-14 coats of varnish -- it is a personal preference balancing how it looks and how much labor to do the work. No wrong -- or right -- answer.

Peter Bigelow
C-25 TR/FK #2092 Limerick
Rowayton, Ct
Port Captain: Rowayton/Norwalk/Darien CT

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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3367 Posts

Response Posted - 03/05/2020 : 06:45:47

I have had good results maintaining the exterior wood with teak oil but that requires my removing and installing Sunbrella covers, each time I sail. Still. it is something to consider and perhaps take it in steps to see if it works for you...perhaps just prepare and use teak oil on the companionway boards with a Sunbrella cover and if that is not too tedious dealing with the cover each time you sail, then consider expanding use of teak oil to additional exterior wood trim. Anyway, here are some photos from last summer/Fall but all wood looks the same. I was on my boat yesterday. I anticipate refreshing all teak oil next month. But all that is needed will be to wash it one day and then apply one teak oil application on all ext wood which should take less than an hour. I first used teak oil on my companionway boards about 3 years ago. All the rest of the ext wood was teak oiled last Spring. By the way, Also made Sunbrella covers for the coamings by cutting a piece of Sunbrella, then at the top and bottom edges I used snaps to form narrow sleeves to slide dowels in the top sleeve and bottom sleeve. Also, when I folded over the material to make the sleeve, I extended the material past the sleeve about 2". I then used spring clamps to clamp it to the coaming. (You can see one of the coaming covers in the last photo.) The photo shows a coaming cover but not the details - the spring clamps are behind it, clamping the 2" material that extends past the top dowel (between the snaps)

Larry
'89 Robin's Nest#5820, Potomac River/Quantico, Va
http://catalina25.homestead.com/olarryr.html

Edited by - OLarryR on 03/05/2020 07:00:28

Catalississippi
1st Mate

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Response Posted - 03/08/2020 : 22:32:39

quote:
Originally posted by Derek Crawford

I bleached the teak to kill the mildew, washed it well, and sanded it to a smooth surface and then applied 3 coats of Cetol with 1 coat of gloss over it.

Wow. Well, I have cleaned/bleached the drawers now. But I�m afraid it�s just a matter of time until the mildew returns. So, any recommendations to a fellow humidity-dweller on what I should do with my interior wood (only the drawers) which I naively oiled? Is varnish necessary? Can I apply it directly over the oil, or must I sand first?

1980 Catalina 25 TR/SK #2098 ?????
Former owner of 1982 Catalina 25 TR/SK #3081 Suzy-Q

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