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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

outboard shaft length

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Deborah
1st Mate

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USA
36 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/13/2016 : 06:32:43

what does catalina recommend for shaft length on 25 ft.

1985 Catalina 25 Fin Keel #5160
"Mottley Crew"
Spring Grove, IL

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2016 : 06:49:39

Both of the C25 Owners' Manuals make the same recommendation. "Long shaft engines are preferable, however, standard length shaft engines should be adequate for most conditions." They also recommend 7.5 hp to 10 hp.

I believe C25 owners will almost universally agree that a standard shaft outboard is inadequate. The prop will lift out of the water in smaller waves, and, if anyone walks to the foredeck, that extra weight forward will cause the prop to lift out of the water. In choppy water, a motor with a standard length shaft will become almost useless. I don't know why Catalina got that recommendation so wrong. They were correct, however, in recommending an engine between 7.5 hp to 10 hp. A 7.5 hp engine will cost less initially, will push a C25 to hull speed, and will ordinarily get better fuel economy than a 10 hp. See the C25 manual at this link. http://catalina-capri-25s.org/manbro/om79-2.asp

Steve Milby J/24 "Captiva Wind"
previously C&C 35, Cal 25, C25 TR/FK, C22
Past Commodore

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3367 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2016 : 08:37:17

Agree with Steve's response. In most conditions like getting in and out of the marina and in fairly calm seas, the standard length shaft is going to be adequate. But it is those less common conditions which most sailors will experience more so when waters are not that calm or less likely but does occur, when a brief storm condition develops when sailing for the day or a cloud passing overhead is one of those with brief but extreme wind conditions is when you need an extra long shaft. I can tell you from personal experience that about 2 years ago, I thought I was done for due to two small clouds that I did not pay attention to but caused extreme wind and rain conditions for about 15 minutes. Even with an extra long shaft, I had one heck of a time due to my 150 genoa and full main sail trying to get the boat under control and when I did start up my outboard to bring it into the wind, the outboard was slightly cavitating and I could not get the boat into the wind until I let the sails completely flap risking sail damage but at that point, that was the least of my worries. Finally, the outboard got me into the wind and I was able to furl in my genoa. From that point on, I was in control. The wind and rain subsided, sun came out and there was no more than a 5 mph wind...but I was a wreck. I was extremely lucky that I was able to get the outboard to bring me into the wind and doubtful that I would have been able to do so with just a long shaft outboard.

I sail frequently and the more you sail, the more likely you will at one time or another encounter uncommon wind conditions or higher than normal seas.

One thing, though, makes it a tougher decision going with an extra long shaft. In my case, when I bought my boat it had a finicky outboard and so I bought a 9.9HP Honda extra long shaft. I believe the older outboard was also an extra long shaft. In any case, I had already replaced the outboard bracket with a 4 spring model prior to buying the new outboard. The hole line-up was exactly the same with the new outboard bracket. So, the new outboard sits fine on the outboard bracket and when the bracket and outboard are in the vertical raised position, one prop blade is partially in the water. When I incline the outboard, it is fully out of the water and at any hull angle, the outboard never comes close to going into the water. In the fully lowered position, the outboard is well below the water surface. So, my bracket setup is fine for the extra long shaft. If your old outboard is the long shaft and you are contemplating getting the extra long shaft, well you are going to have to figure out if your outboard when raised and tilted will pose any issue when sailing. if you believe there is no issue, then go with the extra long shaft. If you believe you may have to drill new holes in the transom to raise the bracket to accommodate the extra long shaft, well then that is something additionally to consider...along with how frequent you go sailing and risk willing to take for those potentially very uncommon upset conditions when you could use the extra long shaft. Then again those upset conditions in your neck of the woods may not be so uncommon. So, it is a decision you have to make.

Larry
'89 Robin's Nest#5820, Potomac River/Quantico, Va
http://catalina25.homestead.com/olarryr.html

Edited by - OLarryR on 06/13/2016 08:50:24

Bladeswell
Captain

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USA
490 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2016 : 10:30:39

Hello Again,

Well I am glad that I read both of these two posts. I have not yet had my boat in the water so I haven't run into any of these issues yet. But obviously, you guys have and so I will take the appropriate action to avoid any potential problems. My boat currently has a 9.9 Suzuki 4 stroke. Unfortunately, it is a 20 inch shaft model as it was always sailed on fresh lakes before I took ownership. But it will be sailed from now on in the Pacific mostly from Long Beach, CA. to Catalina Island. And that passage can be rough at times. Looks like I will be shopping for a new or used 4 stroke 25 inch shaft outboard. Just one more delay to launch day. Not to mention the money. Oh well, better safe than sorry. Thanks everyone.

Bladeswell

C25 TR FK Hull #973 1979 L-Dinette. So.Cal.

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2016 : 20:01:32

You should have no trouble selling the Suzi for a pretty good number. I sold a 6+ year old Honda 8, no electric start, for $1100 13 years ago.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2016 : 07:39:21

quote:
Originally posted by Stinkpotter

You should have no trouble selling the Suzi for a pretty good number. I sold a 6+ year old Honda 8, no electric start, for $1100 13 years ago.

I agree with Dave, my boat (mostly lake sailed before I got it) came with a Johnson 2-stroke 8hp engine. I was able to sell it for twice what I thought it was worth ($800) in one day on Craigslist to another sailor. That went a long way towards the new Tohatsu XL Shaft 9.8 I replaced it with (and don't forget the forum discount for onlineoutboards).

David
C-250 Mainsheet Editor

Sirius Lepak
1997 C-250 WK TR #271 --Seattle area Port Captain --

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2016 : 13:48:33

quote:
Originally posted by delliottg

[quote]Originally posted by Stinkpotter

...(and don't forget the forum discount for onlineoutboards).

Association member discount. Worth many times the dues.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Bladeswell
Captain

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USA
490 Posts

Response Posted - 06/14/2016 : 16:07:31

Hi Again,

Umm.....what discount are we talking about ? Or am I being a noob again...?

Bladeswell

C25 TR FK Hull #973 1979 L-Dinette. So.Cal.

SKS
Navigator

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USA
161 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2016 : 12:38:48

I have to agree with those who say a standard length shaft is inadequate.
Before I bought Lady E (it was another name at that time) I looked at a C25 wing keel on the Hudson river up around Hyde Park.
The owner and I huddled on the foredeck with the outboard running, and with just a small amount of wave action on the Hudson River that far north, I heard the motor coming out of the water and racing. When I made my final purchase, I got the inboard diesel.
The wing keel was in better cosmetic condition, but the inboard diesel is fitted out better. I'll deal with the cosmetic repairs over the next couple of years.

"Lady E" 1986 Catalina 25: Fin Keel, Standard Rig, Inboard M12 Diesel, Sail No. 5339
Sailing out of Norwalk Cove Marina, Connecticut

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2016 : 12:51:50

quote:
Originally posted by Bladeswell

Umm.....what discount are we talking about ? Or am I being a noob again...?

Log into the Members' Area and go to Member Discounts, then down to Online Outboards. We get $75 off the Tohatsu 9.8 XLS (3-1/2 times the price of membership), and different amounts off other sizes of motors. Details are there for members.

I'll admit to being partial to doing business with local vendors where I can check out products and who support me later. And who knows, one might even match that discount if pressed gently. I'm sure it's well within their margin.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 06/16/2016 12:55:17

panhead1948
Captain

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345 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2016 : 08:31:05

Hey Dave you said we get 75 off a 9.8XL and another post says we get 10% which is it?

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2016 : 11:12:28

Check the source--the statement from On-line Outboards in the Members' Area. Also check out their starting price compared to whatever other sources you're considering...

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 06/19/2016 11:13:56

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3754 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2016 : 11:42:52

i also believe in local sourcing, but i also believe in supporting those who support us.

p.s. typing with one hand is a p.i.a.

Dave B. aboard Pearl
1982 TR/SK/Trad. #3399
Lake Erie/Florida Panhandle

Bladeswell
Captain

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USA
490 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2016 : 13:20:14

Hi Again,

Thanks again Dave. The Tohatsu 9.8 xls is available in my area for $2200 and change. I'll have to look into the difference.

Bladeswell

C25 TR FK Hull #973 1979 L-Dinette. So.Cal.

panhead1948
Captain

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345 Posts

Response Posted - 06/19/2016 : 16:00:36

The dealer I talked to in Ohio offered the same price as online outboards

JanS48
Navigator

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USA
141 Posts

Response Posted - 06/28/2016 : 00:14:07

Greetings
For what it's worth you can also purchase a shaft extension kit for approx. $450. It's a bit pricy but I installed one on my 15hp 4stroke Mercury extending the shaft from 20 to nearly 26". It took me about 2 hrs to install, I'm sure others could do it faster. I don't recall the mfg but if you google outboard shaft extension kits I'm sure you'll find one.
HTH
Jan

82 C25 SR FK
Sailing out of Newport Harbor.

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 06/28/2016 : 06:38:38

I've heard that some third party makes kits for Mercuries, but found that no XL kit was available for my old Honda 8-L. Extension involves the housing, drive shaft, exhaust tube, and shift rod, so by the time you're done, you might have better spent the money on upgrading to a new motor (selling the old one) as I did--getting electric start to boot.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

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