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jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/27/2016 : 07:22:10

Hello, James here. I have been a sail boater for most of adult life but always had fixed Keels. A couple of years ago I got a C 22 SK and really enjoyed that additional dimension. But mate and I wanted to have more room. I made a deal for a 79 C 25 SK. It is in good shape.
now I got to haul it 700 miles.
Questions: Any trailer measurement / requirements available and where?
I have a modified Mac 25 trailer single axle (capacity 3400 lbs) I haul my C 22 on, it could be modified for the 25. (add a second axle) And I have found a used dual axle folding tri-marine 4000 lb capacity trailer for sale that looks good to set up for the C 25. It has "needs repair" hydraulic brakes. Which way to go is my question.
I would appreciate comments and info on the trailer requirements and any input on my situation.
thanks James

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

Edited by - jmczzz on 02/27/2016 07:28:11

Davy J
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1511 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2016 : 08:49:52

I never towed my C25, but I have a powerboat trailer that I've done work on. Seems like it would be easier to repair brakes, lines, and coupler than to add an axle. Welcome to the forum.

Davy J

2005 Gemini 105Mc
PO 1987 C25 #5509 SR/SK
Tampa Bay

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2016 : 08:58:50

thanks for that opinion. I am leaning in the direction of the repair of the dual axle.
Do you know where I can find C 25 trailer measurements?
thanks James

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2016 : 12:07:07

Welcome James! Hmmmm... The "base displacement" for the C-25 SK is listed at 4150 lbs., and yours will probably be more, so I seriously question hauling it 700 miles on a trailer rated for less. If Murphy happens to notice, you could have some liability issues.

Curmudgeon out.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 02/27/2016 12:08:05

Bladeswell
Captain

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USA
490 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2016 : 12:14:35

Hello James,

As it happens I too have a 79 C25 however, mine is a fin keel. I don't know the weight difference between fin keels and swingers, but I can tell you that my trailer is a dual axle. I believe my boat or maybe the towed weight comes in somewhere around 6000 lbs. And some say that fully loaded with water, fuel and misc gear that weight can approach 8000 lbs. That well exceeds the capacities of any of the trailers that you mentioned. I would look into the boat weight and towing weight further before spending any money on something that isn't going to work. Best of luck.

Bladeswell

P.S. Just checked my owner's manual. Dave is right. The swinger is listed at 4150 lbs and the FK at 4550 lbs. But keep in mind that is dry weight and with no gear.

C25 TR FK Hull #973 1979 L-Dinette. So.Cal.

Edited by - Bladeswell on 02/27/2016 12:22:24

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2016 : 15:17:02

thanks for the warnings and welcome guys. I will just be bringing the boat home absolutely dry and even can off load battery, boards, boom, sails and any thing else movable to put in the back of the truck. I can get some reinforcements wielded on either trailer too. I just want to get her home within low budget.

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

slim
Navigator

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USA
113 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2016 : 19:48:53

High James

I have recently gone thru a trailer rebuild for a FK C25 1978 and can say that you want to overbuild your trailer for your boat as the boat and trailer together will most certainly weigh in at above 6K dry. Don't forget to check out the tires also as a set of new heavy duty trailer tires can run you another bunch of money. Also don't think that a trailer's capacity is determined by the axles alone you must consider the entire structure along with the braking capacity. Don't want to discourage you but this is as important of a decision as your boat's seaworthiness or even more so. Take your time and do it right, after thoughts on this are very expensive.

1978 - C25 - standard rig - Fixed keel #1040

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 02/27/2016 : 21:14:09

thanks mr. slim, i will. james

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/28/2016 : 11:06:15

Not trying to pile on, but this also begs the question of the tow vehicle you plan to use. How is it for towing capacity? We've had lots of discussions here (use Search on "tow vehicle"), and various people here have described experiences where "the tail wagged the dog"... I watched an extreme case happen in front of us on I-75 in Michigan when a Jeep towing a ~20' powerboat ended up in the ditch by the road with the Jeep facing backward next to the boat--all coming to rest in a dust cloud as we drove by. It probably started with a little surprise causing a tap on the brakes...

So, just curious...

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 02/28/2016 11:07:18

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 02/29/2016 : 12:08:12

91 GMC Jimmy 4 door 4 x 4 V 6 good shape, runs good, mud grips, remote filter increases cap 2 qts, gas hog, but tough, not a daily driver, tow vehicle. I think it'll do I am still waiting for info re my original post? anybody got trailer specs?
Com on guys non of you guys have a C 25 trailer??? poooo... jmc

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/29/2016 : 15:17:03

quote:
Originally posted by jmczzz

91 GMC Jimmy 4 door 4 x 4 V 6 good shape...

Hmmm... Essentially an S-10 Blazer, 4.3 V6... What's the towing capacity in the owner's manual? We're talking about the weight of the boat and the trailer.

I'm not the expert here, but I have my doubts.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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3754 Posts

Response Posted - 02/29/2016 : 18:30:02

I found one source that said 3000 pounds and 300 pound tongue wt for 91 - 94 S-10 on a step bumper. Not a lot of reliable info out there. Also, That capacity isn't half your load. Think 7K and up. Trailer should have a capacity of around 5k and up. My towed weight, always with empty tanks, and an 84 pound 2 stroke was under 6500, but a don't carry much weight in the boat. Many others who've weighed are around 7k, while a few are closer to 6K. Measurements on the trailer have many variables. I have had rollers rather than bunks, that is a major variable. What kind of measurements do you want?

Dave B. aboard Pearl
1982 TR/SK/Trad. #3399
Lake Erie/Florida Panhandle

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 02/29/2016 : 21:32:51

I can think of several major characteristics of the trailer that need to be addressed:

1. The weight of the overall load (including the trailer itself) relative to the rating of the axles (which vary), tires, and brakes, where the overall structure of a commercially built trailer is presumed to match up to the axle capacities.

2. The position of the boat relative to the midpoint between the two axles, which essentially establishes the tracking balance and the tongue weight. This generally is adjustable. Tongue weight is critical.

3. For a swing keel, a resting pad on which the keel can be lowered after the boat is loaded so that (a) the keel does not support the weight of the boat, and (b) the winch, cable and connection hardware don't support the keel as the boat travels over the road.

4. The height, amidships, the boat must sit on the trailer to allow the keel to rest as described in 3.

Sorry, I don't have the answers--I had a fin keel that never saw a trailer. But in my opinion towing a C-25 is a whole different ballgame from a C-22. As much bigger as as the C-25 seems, it's that much or more in terms of what it takes to carry it safely at highway speeds over the road.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 02/29/2016 21:39:23

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 03/01/2016 : 07:12:35

Thanks �Stinkpotter�. Actually Capt. it is a S 15 chassis A T 4x4 with a full 4 door, fold down seat body. I have pulled my fully loaded C -22 several thousand miles over mountains and such. Here i am talking about getting a dry C 25 home a 700 mile tow. The specs say the C 25 SK is 4150. Less than the loaded C-22. It has towed a car hauler 1500 lbs with a ford escort loaded and did ok. The trailer I am looking at does have tandem and hydraulic brakes.
The measurement I need from your post are:
�2. The position of the boat relative to the midpoint between the two axles, which essentially establishes the tracking balance and the tongue weight. This generally is adjustable. Tongue weight is critical.
AND
4. The height, amidships, the boat must sit on the trailer to allow the keel to rest as described in 3."
In other words the bunk height above the keel rest pad.
Further info would be the total bunk length.

I do want to point out I do sincerely appreciate any and all input / comments, regardless of if slightly of topic of O P.
I do not mean to sound otherwise in my post. Just allow for my sarcastic appearing reply post.
I do thank all for reading and replying

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

Edited by - jmczzz on 03/01/2016 07:13:29

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 03/01/2016 : 07:17:05

To clarify; I need the distance from the bow chocks to the midpoint between the axles, the height of the bunks from the keel rest, and the total length of the bunks.

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 03/01/2016 : 07:26:33

quote:
Originally posted by jmczzz

...I do sincerely appreciate any and all input / comments, regardless of if slightly of topic of O P...

That's what we do here.

There have been several who proposed using an inadequate tow vehicle, and some who actually did and regretted it. As you know, it involves the safety of everyone on the road with them. We'd hate to sit silently and let somebody seriously regret it--so we don't.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Response Posted - 03/01/2016 : 09:32:49

Just be careful. I pulled my C25 about 400 miles when I bought it. My vehicle was a Suburban 1500 with a 7,000 pound towing capacity. With the long wheel base it pulled well. I did have some "oh sh#t!" moments when breaking. I encourage you to get the trailer breaks repaired as you plan, and also before you set off for your 700 mile trip, take the boat for a tow a relatively short distance, to get an idea of acceleration and breaking.

I did a lot of research on trailering back when I still had the C25, and if I recall, (confirm on your own) if you DO start to experience the trailer "wagging," accelerating will straighten the rig out. That was my experience anyway. Not making any guarantees, just be careful. It was having to break unexpectedly that always scared the bejeebers out of me.

And good luck!!!

Ben
Beneteau 361
Viking Kitty
Columbus, Ohio

Edited by - Ben on 03/01/2016 09:35:07

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 03/02/2016 : 11:00:37

I did the swing and sway with a load of metal roofing on a flat bed. You are right it is a very scary helpless feeling. Lucky to get her stopped after accelerating. Wet pants for sure!
The trailer I as looking at looked good but when I talked to a trailer re-builder pro he advised against old galvanized steel beamed trailer because galvanized rust from the inside in sea air and you can'r see it until you try to wield to it.
I can take advice from someone with knowledge so i will pass on that one.
Any one know of a trail for sale?
thanks James

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 03/03/2016 : 07:38:47

As you can tell from my signature line, I owned a 1984 C25 SK and I still own a 1975 C22 SK. I had a fin keel trailer for the C25. That trailer empty weighed 1,400 lbs. With the boat, sails, other gear, and outboard, the total rig weight was close to 6,000 lbs. Most of the tow vehicle discussions here in the past have leaned toward the Ford F250, GMC 2500 and related Suburbans, and Ram 2500 class of trucks, primarily because of the heavier duty chassis and brakes on those vehicles. I would never consider towing a C25 with a V6 powered vehicle. not enough power, braking capacity, or mass in front of the trailer. When I sold the boat, the buyer rented a U-Haul truck to move the boat from my lake to his across town. He found one with a class 3 hitch. Another alternative would be to rent a 12-15 passenger van with a class 3 hitch.
BTW, my C22 is a bit on the heavy side at 2,400 lbs and my trailer for it has a cast iron frame. Together, they weigh in at 3,300 lbs. A V6 is fine for that rig.

DavidP
1975 C-22 SK #5459 "Shadowfax" Fleet 52
PO of 1984 C-25 SK/TR #4142 "Recess"
Percy Priest Yacht Club, Hamilton Creek Marina, Nashville, TN

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 03/03/2016 : 08:50:19

thanks for the reality check....James

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 03/04/2016 : 09:33:15

Frankly guys, I did not mean to start a discussion on "tow Vehicles" All I ask for several times was measurements. Again I repeat thanks for all the input. But that is enough about tow vehicles.
Please can any one tell me the measurements of a C 25 SK trailer:
1. from bow chocks to the center between the tandem axles? (That will be the center of balance For the boat.)
2. From the center between the axles to the extreme back end of the trailer's side rails?
3. Height of the bunks above the keel rest?
4. Total length of the bunks?
Again thanks for all the input, but can anyone PLEASE tell me about the trailer measurements.
Regards, James.

2.

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3754 Posts

Response Posted - 03/04/2016 : 14:14:55

My trailer is 163" from the point where the bow eye sits to midpoint of the axles. The axles are 33" center to center. The bow eye is 48" above the trailer rails. I have not done a tongue weight since I had the trailer built last year, but will be getting new weights in about three weeks. Height of the bunks depends on their spacing, but it will be a little over 3' from the keel support to the waterline. No other measurements would be useful from my roller trailer.

Dave B. aboard Pearl
1982 TR/SK/Trad. #3399
Lake Erie/Florida Panhandle

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 03/04/2016 : 14:35:36

YEA! Dave5041 Gave a answer to my questions! Thanks David you restore my faith in the forum. James

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4275 Posts

Response Posted - 03/04/2016 : 22:26:48

We have a really cool feature on this site. It's called Search and can be found in the top right corner of this site.

This should give you a starting point... https://www.catalina-capri-25s.net/cgi-local/MBR_gallery.cgi?Album+2265+132

Also, if you input trailer in the search function it will bring up some very good posts from the past discussing towing and peoples experiences good and bad. Some got quite heated.

Association Member

GaryB
Andiamo
'89 SR/WK #5862
Kemah,TX

Edited by - GaryB on 03/04/2016 22:33:03

jmczzz
1st Mate

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USA
92 Posts

Response Posted - 03/05/2016 : 04:15:12

Thank you Gary. I did search before I made this post. Perhaps I didn't know exactly the right way to "squeeze" out just the info I was after but I gotta night's reading worth of "other" post info not Trailer build specs / measurements. BTW in every forum there is always the wise old member that tells the new comer the "search" story. Thank you for the polite non demeaning manner you have presented yours albeit tinged with sarcasm. (smile) However you astutely point out the problem with the usual �search� function i.e all the non productive non specific stuff one must pour through to glean the info needed. Perhaps a thread on how to stay on topic would be beneficial for old members to contribute. James

1978 C25 SK SR # 808

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 03/05/2016 : 13:15:52

Stay on topic? Ya... I dunno...

We do tend to have discussions that wander off, but at least they're almost always respectful and intended to help. I haven't found that in many other forums. Often they give very direct, to-the-point responses, like "Idiot!" (...or worse.)

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

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