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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Jib Sheet Car Placement

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DavidBuoy
Admiral

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USA
707 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/28/2014 : 07:18:22

I was just curious where most people are setting their cars. This mainly goes out to people sailing with a 110% in 7-12kts of wind. I have my 110% raised up close to the mast head, so the foot is about 1.5-2ft off the deck and typically have the cars set equal to aft part of the frame of the middle port. I am wondering because if I set it so the sheet comes down perpendicular to the forestay, it seems like the shape isn't all that great and it looks like its twists too much. Also makes the foot virtually flat. So i budge it forward till theres a little curve in the foot and what looks to be a decent draft up the sail. Does this sound right?

One negative thing I think this is doing is making the leech too tight and its creating a lip that makes the wind go turbulent. Granted this is a relatively older sail, but definitely still serviceable. Actually, I keep forgetting to check, but I think there might be a leech line on that sail. That might be the 150, but that might be what creating that cup.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 14:39:37

quote:
Originally posted by DavidBuoy

I was just curious where most people are setting their cars. This mainly goes out to people sailing with a 110% in 7-12kts of wind.

Hmmm, maybe the reason for the lack of responses thus far is that everyone else is flying a 150% in 7-12kts.

Seriously though, in general to start, the jib sheet should bisect the angle of the clew then you would adjust the track car position so the telltales along the luff break at the same time. This will get you to a rather neutral position then adjust them accordingly depending on the conditions. To power up the headsail, move them forward. To depower, move them aft.

Edited by - on

DavidBuoy
Admiral

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USA
707 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 18:10:24

Yea, I have a brand new 150 and hate it. Unless I need to get somewhere far away and conditions call for it, it's stayin in the basement. I just wonder the limit of pushing the car too far forward.

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sethp001
Mainsheet C-25 Tech Editor

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814 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 19:39:34

Start with the car causing a 45 degree angle for your jib sheet. Then the car should be moved more forward in light airs, and farther back in heavy airs. Your telltales should all flow back or fall at the same time. If your lower telltales fall but your higher telltales do not, then you need to adjust the cars.

Edited by - sethp001 on 08/28/2014 19:40:49

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2014 : 20:53:59

quote:
Originally posted by DavidBuoy

Yea, I have a brand new 150 and hate it. Unless I need to get somewhere far away and conditions call for it, it's stayin in the basement. I just wonder the limit of pushing the car too far forward.

The jib is made in the shape of a triangle, and it is attached at the three corners. The sailmaker sewed a shape into it that would generate power efficiently. The principal adjustment that can be made to that shape is by the placement of the genoa car. There is one specific placement of the genoa car where your sail will be able to generate it's maximum possible power. Generally, if you place the car either forward or aft of that spot, it will depower the sail. When I found that spot for each sail on my C25, I marked the genoa track with a piece of rigging tape. By doing so, I could always find the ideal spot for the genoa car for each sail. If the wind piped up and I needed to depower the sail, I moved the car aft of the tape marker.

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DavidBuoy
Admiral

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USA
707 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 05:02:28

quote:
Originally posted by Steve Milby

When I found that spot for each sail on my C25, I marked the genoa track with a piece of rigging tape.

That is key. I've been thinking about something like that. Easy marks, no muss no fuss. Look at the wind reading before heading out, set to appropriate marks and roll out. I've just been too lazy to note down the settings i've liked. I get too into the sail and forget. Appreciate the idea, I'll try that out next time im out.

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 10:47:52

quote:
Originally posted by DavidBuoy

quote:
Originally posted by Steve Milby

When I found that spot for each sail on my C25, I marked the genoa track with a piece of rigging tape.

That is key. I've been thinking about something like that. Easy marks, no muss no fuss. Look at the wind reading before heading out, set to appropriate marks and roll out. I've just been too lazy to note down the settings i've liked. I get too into the sail and forget. Appreciate the idea, I'll try that out next time im out.

I'm racing my Cal 25 Saturday and Sunday in the new Annapolis Labor Day Regatta and am short one crew on both days. I could use you on either or both days if you're available. It would be a good opportunity to learn how to fly a spinnaker and to cope with your 150, as well as some sail trimming and boat handling. Party afterward is sponsored by the Annapolis Yacht Club. Let me know.

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dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 11:03:02

If you have telltales on your jib, set the cars so that the telltales break evenly when you head up to wind. If the upper telltale breaks before the others, move the car forward one notch and check again. If the lower telltale breaks first, move the car aft, etc. Hopefully, I don't have that backwards. LOL

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3312 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 13:16:24

David - you are correct. Just remember the 3 "B's" - if the BOTTOM BREAKS first - move it BACK.

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DavidBuoy
Admiral

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USA
707 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 14:15:55

Steve, that sounds like a blast but I'm in Philly for a wedding. Maybe another time!

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jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 20:43:56

Why be hating o a 150% ?

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5851 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2014 : 03:21:45

quote:
Originally posted by jerlim

Why be hating o a 150% ?

Difficult to tack, especially when shorthanded and in lighter winds, and hard to trim in strong winds. Makes the boat heel excessively when beating to windward in strong winds. A 150 can be intimidating, until you learn how to cope with it.

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JohnP
Master Marine Consultant

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1519 Posts

Response Posted - 09/02/2014 : 11:51:30

David,

Steve's offer of joining him for a race is a fantastic opportunity for you to learn about all this stuff from a sailor with advanced skills!

I have only a 110 hank on jib, and have the jib sheet cars set in one spot that never changes. For racing, you may want to install some nifty adjustable genoa sheet cars, like the kind that harken sells. For cruising, keeping the car in the one spot that you find keeps the telltales flying right is the simple fix.

When I go out on the Chesapeake Bay in "big winds" over 15 knots, I use my storm jib and a reefed main, and when I'm feeling energetic single-handing in 3-7 knot winds, I fly my asymmetric spinnaker. The 110 with its preset car location is the everyday jib for me.

Edited by - on

dasreboot
Admiral

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803 Posts

Response Posted - 09/02/2014 : 12:05:34

if the 150 gets hung up too much in light winds, roll it up when head to wind, and unroll it on the other side. I think cutters with narrow slot between the headstays use that technique.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 09/02/2014 : 18:15:15

My first boat came with a gently used 150 and what appeared to be a nearly brand new 110. When I sold it after seven years, it had a well used 150 and a nearly brand new 110.

Edited by - on

dasreboot
Admiral

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803 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2014 : 04:38:22

I have a 110, but the next will be a 150 for light air. maybe I'll get it next year. I'm waiting for a nice ebay roller furling 150

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DavidBuoy
Admiral

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USA
707 Posts

Response Posted - 09/03/2014 : 04:50:12

I think the biggest thing for me is not even when it snags on the stays but really the lack of visibility. In Annapolis we often find ourselves in large packs of other sailing vessels if not in the middle of a race going on. When its just the admiral and I, someone needs to legitimately stand guard which for me is not that fun. Also, our winds have been killer this summer. Out of about 30+/- outings this summer we've had two days that I can remember going out in less than 10kts. One of the times we just flew our Asym and it was great fun. To each their own, but for my situation I think its less useful. Keep in mind that i'm not selling it yet, but i wouldn't be suprised if i end up chopping at least a foot out of the luff.

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