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Lee Panza
Captain

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USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2014 : 10:16:03

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 .. if the spinnaker halyard exited the crane sideways and parallel to the top of the crane. I would think the block would have to lay flat (block cheeks parallel to the top of the crane) in this situation.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That's actually correct, Don. However, if my halyard is leaving the block at that angle it would be an indication that my tack was disconnected :)

In actual service there should be plenty of swing. I added a spacer block under (over) the eyestap for that reason.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2014 : 11:58:20

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Merit 25
 I'm not sure if a 3rd trimmer is really what you want at the mast head. Constantly changing luff tension.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I used to sail a Merit 25.

The idea of a stretchy spin halyard is to absorb gusts a bit. By stretch I simply mean a non low stretch line. As with most things it depends on a person's situation but as a single hander with occasional crew I liked a stretchy halyard.

Edited by - on

Lee Panza
Captain

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USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2014 : 19:34:57

My DSL is down and I've been struggling to make this work from my cell phone. If it works this time it'll be a sketch of my spinnaker crane in X-section showing the range of lateral swing of the turning block (with the block angled back about 45 degrees so it appears to conflict with the eyestrap). Note that the halyard coming off the top of the sheave is near the centerline as it leads aft to the truck.

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 01/02/2014 : 17:20:18

I am exploring spinnaker hardware for a new symmetrical and saw this crane on CD. Perhaps this design replaces what you show above?

http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm/product/2092_625/spinnaker-crane-c-25-c-250-c-27-c-28.cfm

Edited by - on

Lee Panza
Captain

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USA
465 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2014 : 07:33:11

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted I am exploring spinnaker hardware for a new symmetrical and saw this crane on CD. Perhaps this design replaces what you show above?

http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm/product/2092_625/spinnaker-crane-c-25-c-250-c-27-c
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That's the one that was posted on this thread a few days ago, to which I was responding. It's OK, and I'm sure it works well enough for many who have installed one, but it could have been a lot better if the bale was extended farther forward and had a fixed point of connection for the turning block.

There was another thread here not long ago discussing adding a sprit, which would allow the use of a 2nd furler (like the ones in the current Practical Sailor), but the CD crane would probably be unsuitable for that. On my rig the upper swivel would conflict with the upper swivel of my primary furler. It would be nice if CD would get their fabricator to assemble a bolt-on unit that does what I've done but more elegantly than I was capably of.

Edited by - Lee Panza on 01/03/2014 07:42:18

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2014 : 12:18:21

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Merit 25
 Nothing wrong with Robline, but it's heavier and stretches more than flightline. It's also not super expensive all things considered, diameter, and length of line.

The difference in price is closer to a 1/3 (33%) and I wouldn't recommend the dinghy line for sheets on a 25 footer. Actually anything 30' or less. Reason being, on smaller boats you usually are doing end for end gybes. This turns one of the sheets into a guy. I don't believe the robline is suited for a guy on a 25-30' boat in reaching conditions.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I wonder if you are talking about the same line as me. The FSE Robline Dinghy Light line is recommended by them for spinnaker sheets on smaller keelboats, has the same 29 grams per meter weight as the Flightline, and is about 55% of the price of Flightline (71 cents per foot vs $1.35ish). All of this is for 8mm.

It is true that the Dinghy Light has more stretch and less strength. I think of it is a floating/lightweight XLS or Sta-Set, not a dyneema core based line like Flightline.

I originally bought it for asymmetrical spinnaker sheets, but I use it as a guy and sheet on my sym spinnaker as well. I'm a newbie with the sym spinnaker, but haven't had problems with it yet.

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2014 : 16:14:22

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Lee Panza
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted I am exploring spinnaker hardware for a new symmetrical and saw this crane on CD. Perhaps this design replaces what you show above?

http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm/product/2092_625/spinnaker-crane-c-25-c-250-c-27-c
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That's the one that was posted on this thread a few days ago, to which I was responding. It's OK, and I'm sure it works well enough for many who have installed one, but it could have been a lot better if the bale was extended farther forward and had a fixed point of connection for the turning block.

There was another thread here not long ago discussing adding a sprit, which would allow the use of a 2nd furler (like the ones in the current Practical Sailor), but the CD crane would probably be unsuitable for that. On my rig the upper swivel would conflict with the upper swivel of my primary furler. It would be nice if CD would get their fabricator to assemble a bolt-on unit that does what I've done but more elegantly than I was capably of.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">We have a dock neighbor (and friend) that owns a C25 and a machine shop. He is passionate about coming up with custom hardware that is an improvement over stock. If we come up with something viable here, he can fabricate it . . .

Edited by - on

Alan Clark
Captain

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406 Posts

Response Posted - 01/27/2014 : 15:48:02

I have the fix! I have a 170% drifter for Catalina 25 tall rig cut for a furler for sale. This is made by Gleason Spinnakers.It has been used very lightly and comes with sail bag and sheets. There are no cuts or rips. No Mold or mildew. also has tell tales.
I have hotos that I am will to forward. you can email me at aclark1325 at woh dot rr dot com
I am asking $450.00 shipping included for the lower 48 states.

Edited by - on

Merit 25
Deckhand

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13 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2014 : 18:33:48

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by awetmore
I wonder if you are talking about the same line as me. The FSE Robline Dinghy Light line is recommended by them for spinnaker sheets on smaller keelboats, has the same 29 grams per meter weight as the Flightline, and is about 55% of the price of Flightline (71 cents per foot vs $1.35ish). All of this is for 8mm. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
You're missing the point about when you jibe, the sheet becomes the guy. For light air sheets there's nothing wrong with that line. For a guy, I'd want something that's not going to crash into my forestay on every puff while at a hot angle.
I think you're numbers are a little off, 55% of 1.35 is 0.74.
http://www.percentagecalculator.net/
I sell Flightline in 8mm for $1.20/ft. which would explain some discrepancy in percentages.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I originally bought it for asymmetrical spinnaker sheets, but I use it as a guy and sheet on my sym spinnaker as well. I'm a newbie with the sym spinnaker, but haven't had problems with it yet.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> And for sheets it's a great line. Just IMHO not up to the task as guy on a 25+ footer.

Edited by - Merit 25 on 02/19/2014 18:35:07

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 02/19/2014 : 22:48:16

So we are picking nits with numbers now? If so: 33% more than $0.71 is $0.94, not the $1.20 that you sell Flightline for (or the $1.35 that APS does). Do you want to sell it for $0.94 per foot?

I qualified my 55% with "about" because I didn't find it necessary to put the exact number of 52.5%. I rounded up to the nearest 5%.

I get what you are saying about the loads on the guy. I wonder how many Catalina 25s are sailed with a spinnaker on a beam reach in high enough winds to need the low stretch of a dyneema cored guy. I agree with you on the benefits of not knocking your spinnaker pole into the forestay on every puff. I know that guy lines can be under extremely high loads. I do understand why you'd want a dyneema core line on a planning/surfing downwind boat like the Merit 25, but that isn't a Catalina 25. In 15+ knot winds most Catalina 25 racers probably choose to fly NFS and get the time credit rather than just overpowering the boat with a kite on a beam reach.

Edited by - on

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1739 Posts

Response Posted - 03/06/2014 : 20:28:57

Soooo if you want to keep your headsail on your furler AND fly a spinnaker . . . . Or a drifter . . . . their could be a tech section on this very subject!

Edited by - on

Merit 25
Deckhand

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13 Posts

Response Posted - 03/25/2014 : 18:08:50

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by awetmore
 So we are picking nits with numbers now? If so: 33% more than $0.71 is $0.94, not the $1.20 that you sell Flightline for (or the $1.35 that APS does). Do you want to sell it for $0.94 per foot?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
No one can sell Flightline for 0.94/ft b/c that's less than it cost. But I'm sure you knew that. Robline is a cheaper line for a reason. If that reason doesn't matter to you, then there is nothing I can say to convince you that flightline is a better fit for this purpose.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I get what you are saying about the loads on the guy. I wonder how many Catalina 25s are sailed with a spinnaker on a beam reach in high enough winds to need the low stretch of a dyneema cored guy. I agree with you on the benefits of not knocking your spinnaker pole into the forestay on every puff. I know that guy lines can be under extremely high loads. I do understand why you'd want a dyneema core line on a planning/surfing downwind boat like the Merit 25, but that isn't a Catalina 25. In 15+ knot winds most Catalina 25 racers probably choose to fly NFS and get the time credit rather than just overpowering the boat with a kite on a beam reach.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I'll leave those assumptions to you, here on the Cheasepeake, you don't get a credit for racing non-spin b/c they have their own class. Scoring spin and non-spin boats together makes no sense at all. The customers I've dealt with seem very interested in performance cruising (regardless of their type of boat), and simple things to do to improve their overall experience. Like not having to adjust lines as much when the breeze comes up.

Edited by - on

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