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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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NEW OUTBOARD-RECOMMENDATIONS!

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[quote][i]Originally posted by OLarryR[/i]
[br]I believe the general instructions for replacing oil is every 25 hrs of operation or annually....but I could be wrong regarding the hours.  In any case, I perform oil changes annually....and sometimes I have procrastinated and let it go a bit beyond that to say 1 1 /2 years or so.  I have a Honda 9.9 2006 and I never had ill effects from using the regular oil recommended which is not synthetic. No noticeable oil loss except the one time that I forgot to reinstall the dip stick and that was a bit of a mess but even then, when I installed the dipstick after returning to my marina from having the boat out for a week for re-applying anti-fouling paint at a marina across the river, the dip stick reading indicated about half way up the safe range and so I never added oil the whole season and the dipstick reading never changed.

I sail between 40-60 times a year and these are almost always day sailing with most use of the outboard for getting into and out of the marina 10 minutes or so going out and 10 minutes coming back in and then sometimes for 1/2-1 hour if the wind dies, etc. So, I estimate approximately 16-17 hrs of in and out of the marina and perhaps another 6-8 hours for when I have used the outboard longer on a sailing day.....this then being no more than 25-30 hrs tops annually.  This is in river water and I do use the boat all year round, just much less during winter months.  (I was out sailing about a week or so ago.)

My thought is that these outboards are much more forgiving regarding oil management compared to gas fuel.  Almost all issues are regarding moisture in gas or how long the gas has been sitting around or in the fuel lines and carburetor of the outboard. Using Stabil or Startron helps mitigate issues with moisture in the gas tanks and draining or running out the fuel lines and carburetor of the outboard is also a good idea if not using the outboard for prolonged periods or infrequently such as for 3 weeks or more at a time. During winter months, I run the gas out of my outboard if I figure I may not be back on the boat for more than 2 weeks. Usually, I will be down at the marina every 2 weeks or more often to either sail or at least to start up the engine for 5-10 minutes to ensure no deposits dry up inside the fuel lines/internals of the outboard.  During the Spring/Summer/Fall, I am usually on the boat or sailing frequently and so I then do not run the gas out of the outboard - Then I figure it is best to keep the outboard fuel lines and carburetor full of gas t minimize condensation/water forming inside and since outboard used frequently, no deposits with form on the internals.

The above approach has worked fine for me since 2006 but this past year, the outboard now 12-13 years old, it started t act up and cleaning out the internals did not work. But after the carburetor was replaced, the outboard is back to same as new again.

So....being concerned about your oil management is important but it is the gas management that so much more important.  My opinion !
[/quote]

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T O P I C R E V I E W
Enchantment II	Posted - 12/30/2018 : 13:32:34 HI All, Happy and Healthy New Year. Good Sailing! I am shopping for a new outboard. I am looking at a new Toshiba 9.9, Suzuki 9.9, all with an alternator and electric start, long shaft. Any experience with these models, pros and cons. Your opinions are always appreciated.
25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First)
Akenumber	Posted - 03/14/2019 : 18:51:22 Still breaking in the efi tohatsu 9.9. Yes I have to pump a primer bulb. I don't leave the fuel line connected and it probably bleads off a little pressure. And also still very happy.
bigelowp	Posted - 02/20/2019 : 09:30:26 Most engines have a break in period of 20-25 hours at which point oil is to be changed. After that it is something like 100 hours between oil changes. As I typically sail off the mooring, in 12 years I doubt I have put 100 hours on my Tohatsu.
OLarryR	Posted - 02/11/2019 : 09:59:53 Now that I think of it some more, reading your post, it is probably 100 hrs or annual for Hondas as well. I believe the first year it was 25 hrs. In either case for sailboats, generally we do not put that many hours on annually and so the annual requirement becomes the default and for many that means that after their sailing season which oftentimes is not a year-round, they change their oil at the end of the sailing season for the reason(s) Scott stated.
islander	Posted - 02/11/2019 : 06:44:17 My new Tohatsu manual says to change the oil every 100 hours or 6 months. I doubt I come close to 100 hrs in my 6 month season. I change the oil using synthetic at the end of my 6 month season so as not to leave dirty contaminated oil in the engine over the winter that can attack metal.
OLarryR	Posted - 02/11/2019 : 04:56:20 I believe the general instructions for replacing oil is every 25 hrs of operation or annually....but I could be wrong regarding the hours. In any case, I perform oil changes annually....and sometimes I have procrastinated and let it go a bit beyond that to say 1 1 /2 years or so. I have a Honda 9.9 2006 and I never had ill effects from using the regular oil recommended which is not synthetic. No noticeable oil loss except the one time that I forgot to reinstall the dip stick and that was a bit of a mess but even then, when I installed the dipstick after returning to my marina from having the boat out for a week for re-applying anti-fouling paint at a marina across the river, the dip stick reading indicated about half way up the safe range and so I never added oil the whole season and the dipstick reading never changed. I sail between 40-60 times a year and these are almost always day sailing with most use of the outboard for getting into and out of the marina 10 minutes or so going out and 10 minutes coming back in and then sometimes for 1/2-1 hour if the wind dies, etc. So, I estimate approximately 16-17 hrs of in and out of the marina and perhaps another 6-8 hours for when I have used the outboard longer on a sailing day.....this then being no more than 25-30 hrs tops annually. This is in river water and I do use the boat all year round, just much less during winter months. (I was out sailing about a week or so ago.) My thought is that these outboards are much more forgiving regarding oil management compared to gas fuel. Almost all issues are regarding moisture in gas or how long the gas has been sitting around or in the fuel lines and carburetor of the outboard. Using Stabil or Startron helps mitigate issues with moisture in the gas tanks and draining or running out the fuel lines and carburetor of the outboard is also a good idea if not using the outboard for prolonged periods or infrequently such as for 3 weeks or more at a time. During winter months, I run the gas out of my outboard if I figure I may not be back on the boat for more than 2 weeks. Usually, I will be down at the marina every 2 weeks or more often to either sail or at least to start up the engine for 5-10 minutes to ensure no deposits dry up inside the fuel lines/internals of the outboard. During the Spring/Summer/Fall, I am usually on the boat or sailing frequently and so I then do not run the gas out of the outboard - Then I figure it is best to keep the outboard fuel lines and carburetor full of gas t minimize condensation/water forming inside and since outboard used frequently, no deposits with form on the internals. The above approach has worked fine for me since 2006 but this past year, the outboard now 12-13 years old, it started t act up and cleaning out the internals did not work. But after the carburetor was replaced, the outboard is back to same as new again. So....being concerned about your oil management is important but it is the gas management that so much more important. My opinion !
AlMo	Posted - 02/09/2019 : 22:14:16 Since this topic drifted off to oil changes, I would like to hear thoughts on frequency ... have a 2015 Suzuki 9.9 (long shaft I think) and AFAIK only been in fresh H2O, interesting to hear about the custom flush fitting though. Super quiet mill, sometimes I forget it is running when using the tiller extension and sitting forward. I have no records of oil changes, so don't know if synthetic has ever been used. I assume I could switch at next oil change though; don't know when last change was but I burned < 1 tank of fuel all season 2018, so wondering if oil change recommendation is based on # of revs, appearance of the oil, every season, etc. I know, I could always read the fine manual, but this group has more seagoing and lake-going experience and is tons more fun
Enchantment II	Posted - 02/07/2019 : 12:30:39 Thank you all for your experience and knowledge. I think I will go with the Tohatsu 9.9, 25" shaft, alt, elec. start. I will have to change my bracket, but the upgrade will be worth it. I hate outboard motors, but need one to get in and out of my slip.
bigelowp	Posted - 02/03/2019 : 20:44:47 Good thought -- but the weight is still more, albeit better balanced
Stinkpotter	Posted - 02/02/2019 : 10:48:03 Mercury has added the (Tohatsu) 9.9 EFI model, so it's possible they will be dropping (or have already dropped) the 25" carburator version as did Tohatsu. EFI is a breakthrough in this category--hopefully it will enhance reliability in the face of ethanol and the other things that threaten the tiny idle jets in small-engine carburators--generally at the worst possible times for sailors. For people who want light weight and reliability with ample power, here's a thought: Put a bracket on each side of the transom, mount two Tohatsu 6 hp 25" motors on them, and mount remote throttle/shift controls on the sides of both cockpit seats. You get up to 12 hp, twin-screw maneuverability (to move virtually sideways or pivot in place), redundant power, and ease of lifting on and off the brackets. (And what a look! Like having four exhaust pipes on your Prius! )
bigelowp	Posted - 02/02/2019 : 07:35:34 Actually, FWIW -- comparing 9.9 hp 25 inch shaft engines, the Tohatsu has gone from being the lightest to upper mid pack in weight and is now one of the more expensive engines. I would take a hard look at the Mercury which is now the least expensive and lower weight option for elect start/tiller configuration.
bigelowp	Posted - 02/02/2019 : 07:28:51 Too bad that Tohatsu is dropping the 25 inch version of the 9.8 as it weighs over 10 lb. LESS than the 9.9 its being replaced with. Way back when, one of the reasons I went with the Tohatsu vs Mercury (also made by Tohatsu) Yamaha or Honda -- was weight. 10 lb. may not sound like much, but when the weather sours requiring the engine being lowered (or raised) or when removing/putting back on the engine mount, etc., every ounce, IMHO, counts.
Steve Milby	Posted - 01/28/2019 : 07:48:44 quote: Originally posted by islander Steve, Yes they have drain screws and is what I open to get the last bit of gas out when I winterize. Same with my snowblower, lawnmower etc. I open it, let the gas drain out then spray carb cleaner in to rinse out any sediment that might be in the bowl. Thanks Scott. That's good to know. That's what I'll do in the future.
Stinkpotter	Posted - 01/28/2019 : 07:23:44 quote: Originally posted by islander The Tohatsu 9.8 is for some reason no longer offered in the ultra long 25" version. The Tohatsu web site still shows it but If you call around like online outboards they will tell you nope, sorry. From Tohatsu in response to my e-mail query: "We recently dropped the 25" shaft from the MFS9.8 line-up and replaced it with our new MFS9.9 EFI model. I will inform our marketing dept. that the website still incorrectly lists the 25" shaft."
islander	Posted - 01/28/2019 : 05:15:20 Steve, Yes they have drain screws and is what I open to get the last bit of gas out when I winterize. Same with my snowblower, lawnmower etc. I open it, let the gas drain out then spray carb cleaner in to rinse out any sediment that might be in the bowl.
Steve Milby	Posted - 01/27/2019 : 19:15:40 I wonder if carburetors on outboard motors have a drain screw in the bottom of the carb bowl, like many lawn mowers and snow blowers. Has anyone ever looked? Draining the gas out of the carb bowl would seem to be a good way to winterize the motor. If you run the engine until it stops and then drain the carb bowl, I can't think why you'd have to add a stabilizer.
Stinkpotter	Posted - 01/27/2019 : 19:06:24 quote: Originally posted by islander Ken I'm curious with the EFI do you still have to pump the primer bulb? Without a carb bowl to fill and the EFI not being vented like a carb is the fuel would always hold it's prime? Maybe?? Mine is a much bigger EFI motor, but often goes a few weeks between uses. Like a car, I have no bulb to squeeze, and starting is always within very few revolutions. As you pointed out, there's no bowl to go dry. It might take more turns after a winter on the hard, but only my mechanic would know. I would still always stabilize the fuel, and "running the motor dry" might be a more debatable strategy, especially with a stabilizer.
islander	Posted - 01/27/2019 : 10:46:03 Ken I'm curious with the EFI do you still have to pump the primer bulb? Without a carb bowl to fill and the EFI not being vented like a carb is the fuel would always hold it's prime? Maybe??
Akenumber	Posted - 01/27/2019 : 09:16:50 Used the new Tohatsu 9.9 efi for the first time. Electric start is nice, but I was mostly after the alternator. I have had some skin end up on the traveler cleat starting the old motor in a panic. Electric start could have prevented that. The new motor seems to run pretty smooth and has a lot of thrust. Aside for a slight rattle at certain rpms coming from the trim mechanism it is super quiet. We keep a lot of weight on board and we're doing over 5 knts at 1/4 throttle with a not so clean bottom. Awesome. Can't wait to go on a short passage. And the extra weight over the old 8hp 2stroke is surprisingly OK with a 3 spring mount.
bigelowp	Posted - 01/26/2019 : 15:33:41 With our Tohatsu, the only reason we opted for electric start is because it included an alternator to charge batteries. How often do we use the electric start? Rarely. When we have not used the engine for a while we will use electric start, but when we are using the boat once a week or more we use pull start as it starts first or second pull.
islander	Posted - 01/25/2019 : 15:49:00 The Tohatsu 9.8 is for some reason no longer offered in the ultra long 25" version. The Tohatsu web site still shows it but If you call around like online outboards they will tell you nope, sorry.
Stinkpotter	Posted - 01/25/2019 : 10:11:04 quote: Originally posted by ted I'm leaning towards a Tohatsu 6hp but it's not available with electric start. I don't particularly want a bigger motor, more weight. Any ideas? According to the Tohatsu site, their 6, 9.8, and 9.9 all come in 25" "transom height" versions, while the 8 does not. The 8 and the 9.8 are the same displacement (209 cc) and weight (81 lbs.). The 9.9, with EFI, is bigger (333 cc) and heavier (95 lbs.). So if you want electric start and fairly light weight, the 9.8 might be best. If you don't care about electric start, want light weight, and don't run in "big water" or heavy conditions, the 6 could be good. But I'd suggest 25" in just about any case, so I'd rule the 8 out. And because I mounted and removed mine just once a season in a boatyard, my Honda's weight (107#) wasn't a concern.
Steve Milby	Posted - 01/25/2019 : 08:08:38 The Tohatsu 8 HP Outboard Motor model # MFS8BEFL has both electric and pull start. It weighs 90 lbs. It's probably the smallest electric start available.
ted	Posted - 01/25/2019 : 07:37:05 I'm leaning towards a Tohatsu 6hp but it's not available with electric start. I don't particularly want a bigger motor, more weight. Any ideas? Ted
Stinkpotter	Posted - 01/24/2019 : 22:13:51 Another consideration, and I don�t know how this applies to Tohatsu products, is that some outboards only have alternators if they have electric starters. That said, I was fairly able-bodied when we had our C-25, but I appreciated not having to reach down over the transom and under the pushpit to pull a starter rope, which I did with the motor that came with the boat. The push-button on the replacement was really, really nice. But we also loved our roller-furler, and we weren�t racers�we were wimpy day-sailors who slept aboard occasionally. Different strokes...
glivs	Posted - 01/24/2019 : 18:47:00 A different twist on Steve's wording is that it also depends on how the boat is used. If you mostly single hand or sail with the Admiral, you may not highly value electric start, but if a situation arose where the Admiral had to start the boat unaided or wanted herself to sail single-handed, you might value electric start a bit differently.

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Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.